Macedonians Storm Parliament

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  • Albo
    Member
    • May 2014
    • 304

    Ok firstly i need be careful because of the censorship on the forum as to what I say and how I say it...

    Albo:

    While I understand that DPMNE has used the Tirana Platform as a propaganda tool to a certain extent, you're ignoring the essential point:

    3 political parties from Country A agreed to a political platform regarding Country A's internal affairs at a meeting in Country B under guidance of Country B's Prime Minister, who is of the same ethnicity as those 3 Country A's political parties.

    Why couldn't they agree to an agenda somewhere in Macedonia? Why did they have to involve the Prime Minister of Albania?
    Now how do I put this.. this is where the whole "Tirana Platform" confusion across ethnic groups begins ..

    The 3 Albanian parties that are signatories to the "Joint Albanian party declaration" drew up the declaration in Skopje,, all 3 parties agreed on the content.. BUT,,, It was the BESA party who refused to agree to sign the declaration in the presents of Ali Ahmeti..((who they campaigned heavily against -as an immoral sellout criminal)) they insisted on an outside mediator..

    WHY?
    Well a few theories exist as to why they insisted on Tirana being the mediator to bring all the parties together... firstly they didn't want to take on the image as willingly sitting and agreeing to a deal with Ahmeti, whom they called every name under the sun during the campaign.. So e deal signed in Tirana under the auspices of Edi Rama in the name of National unity was easier to sell to their electorate.

    Another theory is that Gruevski had threatened BESA that it would investigate its questionable funding sources from abroad (mostly via TIKA in Turkey) if it didn't insist on Tirana mediating so then vmro could coin and exploit the term "Tiraska Platforma" and in return BESA would be seen favorably by vmro if there were to be reelections as vmro's junior Albanian party ahead of dui or dpa...

    So the role of Tirana being the mediator wasn't born in Tirana.. it came as a request from the Albanian parties of Macedonia...
    Hence none of the content part of the declaration is Tirana influenced nor are any points added outside the platforms of the parties..

    I personally believe it was wrong for besa to insist on Tirana mediating especially considering the situation Macedonia was in and how it strengthened Gruevski's propaganda machine with ammunition... It was totally unnecessary in the context of the situation.. but was also over exaggerated in the media.

    And you're lying to yourself if you insist that there is no direction, funding or support for Macedonia's Albanian political parties coming from Albania or even Kosovo.
    Can you show me any proof of funding or projects from Albania or Kosovo to Albanians in Macedonia?
    The only project 'im aware of where Tirana has funded anything outside Albania to Albanians is a $100,000 grant to jointly help fund a maternity hospital in Preshevo (Southern Serbia)

    Comment

    • Amphipolis
      Banned
      • Aug 2014
      • 1328

      Can you give us a brief description of the Albanian parties and their differences? Will all three of them be in the government now?

      Comment

      • DraganOfStip
        Senior Member
        • Aug 2011
        • 1253

        Newly released video footage of the parliament's security cameras show 2 DPMNE MP's (Krsto Mukoski and Sasho Vasilevski) removing the metal security locks from the doors and then the crowd flows in, embracing and receiving directions from other DPMNE MP's as to where they should go.
        Anyone still having doubts about who organized the April 27th events?

        ”A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices”
        ― George Orwell

        Comment

        • Albo
          Member
          • May 2014
          • 304

          Video Shows MPs Aiding Macedonia Parliament Assailants

          - See more at: http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti....GN64X8LF.dpuf

          Comment

          • Albo
            Member
            • May 2014
            • 304

            SRAM !

            Article by Besa Arifi

            Comment

            • vicsinad
              Senior Member
              • May 2011
              • 2337

              Serbian intelligence officer among those who stormed parliament...

              "Serbian intelligence officer was in Macedonian Assembly"
              Adviser at the Serbian embassy in Skopje and BIA officer Goran Zivaljevic was in the Assembly of Macedonia as it was stormed by violent protesters on April 27.

              This has been reported by Macedonian television Telma.

              According to a research team of TV Telma and daily Koha, Zivaljevic, former deputy director of the BIA, and now its active officer in the embassy in Skopje for a third term, entered the Assembly after 20:00 hours, together with a group of people in the crowd, and went to te plenary hall, where they were deputies of VMRO-DPMNE. According to sources of Telma and Koha, Zivaljevic had his picture taken there.

              When asked what he was doing in the Assembly of Macedonia, outside the diplomatic protocol, Goran Zivaljevic told television Telma that he was in parliament on official building, to see whether the incidents persons from Serbia, fans or extremists, were involved in the incident.

              The research of Thelma and Koha states that Zivaljevic is known to the regional public thanks to a number of controversial events.

              His wife Olivera Antonic, it is added, testified about the murder of journalist Slavko Curuvija. At the time she was working in the State Security Service in the department for wiretapping and making minutes of conversations from the apartment of Curuvija after his murder.

              There are indications that Zivaljevic took part in organizing a meeting in June last year in Moscow, attended by President of the Democratic Party of Serbs in Macedonia Ivan Stojiljkovic, as a signatory of the Russian regional initiative for the establishment of a militarily neutral territory in the Balkans.

              Before arriving to the diplomatic mission in Skopje Goran Zivaljevic was a diplomat in Croatia in 2014, but the intelligence service there complained to Serbian colleagues about his work, after which he left Croatia, said TV Telma.

              It is added that so far there has been no reaction from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Macedonia on whether measures had been taken against the Serbian intelligence officer because of his presence in the Assembly of Macedonia on April 27.

              Comment

              • DraganOfStip
                Senior Member
                • Aug 2011
                • 1253

                The Ministry Of Interior identified 7 MP's seen on the parliament's security cameras' footage assisting the mob that broke into the parliament on April 27th.
                Those are: Krsto Mukoski, Ljuben Arnaudov, Sasho Vasilevski, Ilija Dimovski, Johan Tarculovski and Zaklina Peshevska (all of them from DPMNE) and Ljupco Dimovski from the Socialist Party (DPMNE coalition partners). These can be seen disabling the security locks on the doors and directing the mob once they got in.
                Despite this, the Public Prosecutor (Grujo's pawn Zvrlevski) still hasn't called them for questioning in order to determine a crime or violation.

                Министерството за внатрешни работи го известило Основното јавно обвинителство дека презело мерки и активности во врска со Наредба за утврдување […]
                ”A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices”
                ― George Orwell

                Comment

                • vicsinad
                  Senior Member
                  • May 2011
                  • 2337

                  Macedonia’s foreign ministry summons Serbian ambassador
                  By Associated Press May 26 at 8:50 AM



                  SKOPJE, Macedonia — Macedonia’s foreign ministry has summoned Serbia’s ambassador to explain the presence of a Serbian diplomat and intelligence officer in the country’s parliament during the building’s storming by protesters last month. The incident left more than 100 people injured.

                  The ministry on Friday expressed “dissatisfaction and concern about the unauthorized presence of a diplomat” during the violent events of April 27 and requested detailed explanations.

                  It says such activity “does not contribute to enhancing mutual trust and promoting good neighborly relations and cooperation that both countries advocate.”

                  Serbia’s Foreign Minister Ivica Dacic has defended the presence of the diplomat, Goran Zivaljevic, saying he did not violate diplomatic protocols or rules.

                  “It is his job to inform about what is going on in the Republic of Macedonia,” Dacic said Thursday.

                  Copyright 2017 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

                  Comment

                  • Phoenix
                    Senior Member
                    • Dec 2008
                    • 4671

                    Originally posted by vicsinad View Post

                    “It is his job to inform about what is going on in the Republic of Macedonia,” Dacic said Thursday.
                    I reckon that's a fair call, given that he's an intelligence officer, no better way to gather information than to have boots on the ground and mixing with the masses...his incompetence was proven by the fact that he was easily identified...and I'm guessing that would've been because of his Macedonian counterparts being at the same place and doing the same thing.

                    Comment

                    • vicsinad
                      Senior Member
                      • May 2011
                      • 2337

                      Originally posted by vicsinad View Post
                      That makes me think: perhaps after a census is conducted and the true Albanian population percentage of the totals are discovered, we can incorporate that many Albanian words into the Macedonian language. If they're 20%, 1 out of every 5 Macedonian words will be an Albanian word. All Macedonian citizens learn 1 language in school -- the new Macedonian State Language (perhaps called the FYROM language) that accurately represents the ethnic (linguistic) make-up of the country -- and that will be the official language. Then whoever wants to speak Albanian or Macedonian at home or anywhere outside of government/school can be free to do so.

                      *please don't take this seriously...

                      (it's a sad state of affairs when I feel like I must let people know I'm joking)

                      Apparently, Xhaferi took my comments seriously:



                      ЕДЕН ЗБОР НА АЛБАНСКИ, ДВА НА МАКЕДОНСКИ: Џафери микса јазици по потреба (ВИДЕО)

                      На денешната седница беше забележително дека Џафери миксаше јазици по потреба и дека во најголем дел го користеше македонскиот, додека на албански им се обраќаше на пратениците од ВМРО-ДПМНЕ.

                      A word of Albanian, TWO OF MACEDONIAN: Xhaferi mix languages ​​if required (VIDEO)

                      At today's meeting it was notable that Xhaferi mix languages ​​when required and mostly used the Macedonian, and Albanian speaking to MPs of VMRO-DPMNE.

                      Comment

                      • Soldier of Macedon
                        Senior Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 13670

                        Originally posted by vicsinad View Post
                        Apparently, Xhaferi took my comments seriously:

                        http://telegraf.mk/aktuelno/makedoni...ri-jazici.nspx
                        Has this guy actually delivered an address in Albanian (fully, not just throwing in a word or two when talking in Macedonian) in official proceedings whilst in the capacity of Macedonian parliament speaker, which required translation in Macedonian? Did he do that in his previous position when aligned with DPNE? God help Macedonia, as if it wasn't bad enough that Gruevski chose this guy of all people - a proven enemy of the state - as the defence minister. Now this with Zaev.
                        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talat_Xhaferi

                        During the 2001 insurgency, in which ethnic Albanian militants attacked security forces, Xhaferi was at first a senior officer in the ARM, commanding troops in the Tetovo barracks. On April 28, the day of the Vejce massacre, he was on duty as commander at the barracks. [2] Several days later he deserted and joined the National Liberation Army (NLA), the Albanian rebel group, and became its commander of the 116th Brigade with the nickname of "commander Forino", from his birthplace.[3] He was later amnestied, following the Ohrid agreement.[1]
                        In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                        Comment

                        • vicsinad
                          Senior Member
                          • May 2011
                          • 2337

                          Apparently, he opened session in Albanian. (If you watch the video in the link, a translator is used to translate from Albanian into Macedonian). Later, Milososki called him out , stating that the law of languages doesn't allow for parliament to be addressed in any other language than Macedonian.

                          Comment

                          • Soldier of Macedon
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 13670

                            Originally posted by vicsinad View Post
                            Apparently, he opened session in Albanian. (If you watch the video in the link, a translator is used to translate from Albanian into Macedonian). Later, Milososki called him out , stating that the law of languages doesn't allow for parliament to be addressed in any other language than Macedonian.
                            Yes, in the first half of the video it appears he is speaking Albanian, then afterwards in Macedonian. На граѓаните на Република Македонија кои го прифаќаат ова, сакам да ви го честитам, or perhaps more appropriately, ju pėrgėzoj. Morons.
                            In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                            Comment

                            • Albo
                              Member
                              • May 2014
                              • 304

                              As far as I know the law allows him to speak Albanian as a speaker of parliament.. hence the previous speaker Veljanovski NEVER MISSED A SESSION OF PARLIAMENT in the whole time vmro were in power as to not allow the deputy speaker Rafiz Aliti to take his place. I remember reading that he wasthe only speaker in the Balkans to never miss a session for i dunno how many years in a row!

                              Comment

                              • Karposh
                                Member
                                • Aug 2015
                                • 863

                                ЕДЕН ЗБОР НА АЛБАНСКИ, ДВА НА МАКЕДОНСКИ: Џафери микса јазици по потреба (ВИДЕО)

                                На денешната седница беше забележително дека Џафери миксаше јазици по потреба и дека во најголем дел го користеше македонскиот, додека на албански им се обраќаше на пратениците од ВМРО-ДПМНЕ.
                                On a side note, but still very much related, I want to call out the ever prevalent "anglismi" (adopted English words) entering everyday speech in the Macedonian media. "Miksa, Miksirashe" from the English Mix. This is a pet peeve of mine and far from enriching our language, as some have suggested, it cheapens it. I can understand borrowing words from related Slavic-based languages when we are lacking a certain word in our language but to replace words with anglismi when we have perfectly good words to do the job is a shame. What is wrong with "mesha" instead of the made up word of "miksa"? Is there an authority in Macedonia that safeguards our language from such foolish and idiotic practices? Other common anglismi that I often here in the Macedonian media are "stopirashe" & "finishirashe" for zavrshe, zapre or prestana. And they have the nerve to poke fun at Macedonians from Australia or North America when we use such gems as "lajtot", "karot", "stritot" or "shopot" in place of semafor, kola, ulica and prodavnica.

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