Greek orthodox church

[Bill77]

The Greek Orthodox religion, is something rarely brought up and i for one have little understanding of. But i have many questions. Such as, why they celebrate Easter with All the other Christian Orthodox Religions but Majority (not all) Celebrate Christmas with the Catholics. Please understand i am not here to demean or criticise there's, or any other faith. Just curious about there religion purely for educational purpose. Keep in mind in my understanding, there is a diferance between Faith (worshiping God) and religion (man made rules). Now i expect us Macedonians to be respectful towards there religion (unlike they show no respect for ours), and please don't turn this into a religious war of words. Only facts backed with evidence with jokes and asumptions aside. If this subject is taboo, i sincerely apoligise and the administrators can delete it and i will perfectly understand why.


Now to save time, i will answer now to questions i asume will be brought up and directed to me.

Q) why don't i go to a Greek thread or priest or reserch on the net?

A) with out causing waves, i believe the answers would be to biased (understandably) and am looking for a balanced view or prospective.


Q) Macedonians would be negative or sarcastic.

A) i am old enough and and believe that i am intelligent enough to desipher and dismis what is fact and what is garbage. All i can do is plead to the people not to be stupid, but also you must understand that if certain explanation is made with quotes from a source, and its ofensive because it go's against your beleif or understanding, it can not be looked at as demeaning. We can not shoot the messanger.

Q) This is dangerous teritory, so is it wise to discuss?

A) for intelligent people, that only strive for knowledge and a healthy discusion, There is nothing to be ashamed or scared of.

Yours sincerely......Bill

[Risto the Great]

Hello Bill, welcome.
My first question is what do you mean by the Greek Orthodox Church? I will assume you are referring to the breakaway Church of Greece created in 1850 for the benefit of christians of Greece at the time.

I think the largest contributor to the mixed dates is the blur between church and state in Greece. Greece adopted the new calendar in the 1920's and yet Easter had some very stringent definitions in the christian faith that could not be ignored. Such that:

The date of Easter was determined by the 1st ecumenical Council the year 325 A. D. In Nicea, by 318 bishops, representing all of Christendom. It was this council that decreed that Easter must be celebrated on the first Sunday following the first full moon of the spring Equinox (March 21), but always after the Hebrew Passover.

Many Greeks oppose this relatively recent approach and celebrate christian events on the Julian calendar dates that the majority of pravoslavni still use today.

[Bill77]

Hello Bill, welcome.
My first question is what do you mean by the Greek Orthodox Church? I will assume you are referring to the breakaway Church of Greece created in 1850 for the benefit of christians of Greece at the time.

I think the largest contributor to the mixed dates is the blur between church and state in Greece. Greece adopted the new calendar in the 1920's and yet Easter had some very stringent definitions in the christian faith that could not be ignored. Such that:

Many Greeks oppose this relatively recent approach and celebrate christian events on the Julian calendar dates that the majority of pravoslavni still use today.

Thanks for your response.Risto. I understood there are two calenders 1 the Julian as you bring up and 1other that slips my mind. i understanding is Orthodox folows the older one and the rest follow the newer one ie catholics protestants. But greeks folow in between. is there a third? which is half of the julian and half the new one i think called gregorian.

Why i bring it up is my mother taught me something. She said that the French has something to do with this change. after the French asistance towards greece post otoman being expelled, insisted Greece change religion towards the catholic faith as a return of favour or was it a condition the french set in return for there help. Greece pleaded to the French to at least let them keep there own easter day so that they can atleast have some of there own identity.

How much was this true? where can i find facts?

if what i breifly know is true, it will just show that our neighbours have sold there soul for Land. And would sell there mothers for a lie.

[Risto the Great]

Hi Bill, I think that is a pretty simplistic view as to why they changed their religious calendar. The breakaway church of Greece is still quite new and is obviously still finding itself. One day it might even have jurisdiction over northern Greece.

[Bij]

Hello Bill, welcome.
My first question is what do you mean by the Greek Orthodox Church? I will assume you are referring to the breakaway Church of Greece created in 1850 for the benefit of christians of Greece at the time.

I think the largest contributor to the mixed dates is the blur between church and state in Greece. Greece adopted the new calendar in the 1920's and yet Easter had some very stringent definitions in the christian faith that could not be ignored. Such that:

Many Greeks oppose this relatively recent approach and celebrate christian events on the Julian calendar dates that the majority of pravoslavni still use today.

Has anyone noticed how the majority of "Greeks" who celebrate by the old calendar are from Northern Greece aka Macedonia??

[Prolet]

Has anyone noticed how the majority of "Greeks" who celebrate by the old calendar are from Northern Greece aka Macedonia??

You mean Egejska Makedonija

[Bill77]

Hello, its been a while . Here is something i can add to this thread.

Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens

He was born Ioannis Liapis (Greek: Ιωάννης Λιάπης, Iōánnēs Liápēs) in Oinofyta, Boeotia. He is an Arvanite. (Albanian)

I know wiki isn't a sure source. But this wiki link provides the source (Bintliff, John (2003), "The Ethnoarchaeology of a “Passive” Ethnicity: The Arvanites of Central Greece" in K.S.... Brown and Yannis Hamilakis, eds., The Usable Past: Greek Metahistories, Lexington Books. p.139) for the claim that Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens is an Albanian.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archbishop_Ieronymos_II_of_Athens

[TrueMacedonian]

Hello, its been a while . Here is something i can add to this thread.

Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens

He was born Ioannis Liapis (Greek: Ιωάννης Λιάπης, Iōánnēs Liápēs) in Oinofyta, Boeotia. He is an Arvanite. (Albanian)

I know wiki isn't a sure source. But this wiki link provides the source (Bintliff, John (2003), "The Ethnoarchaeology of a “Passive” Ethnicity: The Arvanites of Central Greece" in K.S.... Brown and Yannis Hamilakis, eds., The Usable Past: Greek Metahistories, Lexington Books. p.139) for the claim that Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens is an Albanian.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archbishop_Ieronymos_II_of_Athens

Nice post bill

[Daskalot]

Hello, its been a while . Here is something i can add to this thread.

Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens

He was born Ioannis Liapis (Greek: Ιωάννης Λιάπης, Iōánnēs Liápēs) in Oinofyta, Boeotia. He is an Arvanite. (Albanian)

I know wiki isn't a sure source. But this wiki link provides the source (Bintliff, John (2003), "The Ethnoarchaeology of a “Passive” Ethnicity: The Arvanites of Central Greece" in K.S.... Brown and Yannis Hamilakis, eds., The Usable Past: Greek Metahistories, Lexington Books. p.139) for the claim that Archbishop Ieronymos II of Athens is an Albanian.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archbishop_Ieronymos_II_of_Athens

And here is the complete article by Bintliff:
The Arvanites of Central Greece, the Slavs and the modern Greeks!

From here on this information is VERBATIM!

And here is the page in question, the information is in the first 1/4 of the text.

[Bill77]

Thank you TM for this great find



Who was the first Head of the 'greek' church?

http://books.google.com/books?id=DRs...age&q=&f=false

The Church of Greece came into being in 1833 when the Bavarian regency unilaterally proclaimed, in the name of King Otto, its independence from the Patriarchate of Constantinople. By the same royal decree of July 1833 - the work of Georg von Maurer and two prominent supporters of a Greek national church, Theokletos Pharmakidis and Spyridon Trikoupis - it became autocephalous, acquired its own synod, and recognized King Otto as its head.

Greece: the modern sequel, from 1831 to the present By Giannēs Koliopoulos, Thanos Veremēs


So King Otto was the first head of the newly formed 'greek' church Of course it would be a non-"greek".

[TrueMacedonian]

Bill I decided to post all the relevant pages. I'll post one more because it's not only relevant to their church myths but also relevant to what happened with the "name-issue"

[Bill77]

Like always, your posts are Gold TM thanks brat


Deneska bev na zakop i bog da go prosti. Vo grcka crkva bev i mislev deka nema da razbervam. Grckiot pop (da mu go ebam kandiloko) pejeshe 50% grcki i 50% angliski.

ama se zachudiv site veleja "bog da go prosti" i samo po makedonski se zborvashe. zalno e makedonsko barat ama na grckata crkva se molat. aide razberise sega so niv.

[Risto the Great]

Bill, I cannot understand any of what you said .... and I understood all of what you said. Za zhal.

[Komita]

The Greek Orthodox religion, is something rarely brought up and i for one have little understanding of. But i have many questions. Such as, why they celebrate Easter with All the other Christian Orthodox Religions but Majority (not all) Celebrate Christmas with the Catholics. Please understand i am not here to demean or criticise there's, or any other faith. Just curious about there religion purely for educational purpose. Keep in mind in my understanding, there is a diferance between Faith (worshiping God) and religion (man made rules). Now i expect us Macedonians to be respectful towards there religion (unlike they show no respect for ours), and please don't turn this into a religious war of words. Only facts backed with evidence with jokes and asumptions aside. If this subject is taboo, i sincerely apoligise and the administrators can delete it and i will perfectly understand why.


Now to save time, i will answer now to questions i asume will be brought up and directed to me.

Q) why don't i go to a Greek thread or priest or reserch on the net?

A) with out causing waves, i believe the answers would be to biased (understandably) and am looking for a balanced view or prospective.


Q) Macedonians would be negative or sarcastic.

A) i am old enough and and believe that i am intelligent enough to desipher and dismis what is fact and what is garbage. All i can do is plead to the people not to be stupid, but also you must understand that if certain explanation is made with quotes from a source, and its ofensive because it go's against your beleif or understanding, it can not be looked at as demeaning. We can not shoot the messanger.

Q) This is dangerous teritory, so is it wise to discuss?

A) for intelligent people, that only strive for knowledge and a healthy discusion, There is nothing to be ashamed or scared of.

Yours sincerely......Bill

They changed their calender because their church is under openly influence of the Vatican so is the Patriarch in Constantinople.
Mounth Athos is still under the older calender.
Catholicism and Prostentatism are shischmatics and the less contact our churches have with them the better.

[Bill77]

They changed their calender because their church is under openly influence of the Vatican so is the Patriarch in Constantinople.
Mounth Athos is still under the older calender.
Catholicism and Prostentatism are shischmatics and the less contact our churches have with them the better.

Yes i am aware they are devided. some elect to stick to the Julian Calender, but there main church claim they converted to the Gregorian Calender. But this is my question, You can't folow both calenders its un heard of. The Greek orthadox celebrate Easter acording to the Julian Calender, But celebrate Christmas acording to the Gregorian Calender. Have they created there own calender. There is something not right here.