The Real Ethnic Composition of Modern Greece

[El Bre]

Thanks, so that makes the Grekoman who speaks only Greek and knows no better then he is also per definition Greek. That is his reference, and myself I would not find that incorrect. Like your reference is that you are Macedonian.

It all depends on your definition of a Gerkoman. I don't know who it is you are referencing, but the Gerkomani I know were neighbours and at times even relatives. Their metamorphisis was witnessed first hand and they definately didn't speak only Greek.

[Risto the Great]

spot on. i only pity the grkomani, i do not seek to claim them, they are greek in the modern sense of the word.

They live there ... in a country that does not let them be anything else.
How long will you maintain the rage?
I know one Macedonian who can barely live in that country. He is virtually the equivalent of the Muslims wearing hijabs and completely unable to speak English in Australia. Very much marginalised and a social outcast after the 80 year strategy in Northern Greece. He is what we Macedonians respect and admire. He is 50 years old and unmarried due to his no-compromise brand of being Macedonian in a country that remains backwards in human rights.

Is this what we want for our Macedonian brothers & sisters in Greece?

We want them to rise up for their human rights. We are talking about people oppressed for 600 years. They are so whipped they even believe the new brand of Greekness is a superior culture. How utterly pathetic. Is this rational thought? Clearly not, but we are talking about Greece!

Yet these people hate mixed marriages in Greece. They are still annoyed at the preferential treatment of the transplanted Christians from Turkey and make fun of the Macedonians who pretend to not remember how their ancestors were not the ideal Greeks they have become now.

I do not call these people Grkomani. They are modern Greeks in an ethnically diverse environment that denies diverse ethnicities. But modern Greeks like the Macedonians of Greece used to be very different people 50 years ago. Many like me are testament to that.

[toothpaste]

They live there ... in a country that does not let them be anything else.
How long will you maintain the rage?
I know one Macedonian who can barely live in that country. He is virtually the equivalent of the Muslims wearing hijabs and completely unable to speak English in Australia. Very much marginalised and a social outcast after the 80 year strategy in Northern Greece. He is what we Macedonians respect and admire. He is 50 years old and unmarried due to his no-compromise brand of being Macedonian in a country that remains backwards in human rights.

Is this what we want for our Macedonian brothers & sisters in Greece?

We want them to rise up for their human rights. We are talking about people oppressed for 600 years. They are so whipped they even believe the new brand of Greekness is a superior culture. How utterly pathetic. Is this rational thought? Clearly not, but we are talking about Greece!

Yet these people hate mixed marriages in Greece. They are still annoyed at the preferential treatment of the transplanted Christians from Turkey and make fun of the Macedonians who pretend to not remember how their ancestors were not the ideal Greeks they have become now.

I do not call these people Grkomani. They are modern Greeks in an ethnically diverse environment that denies diverse ethnicities. But modern Greeks like the Macedonians of Greece used to be very different people 50 years ago. Many like me are testament to that.

Most of the people you call Grecomans ,have lost grandfathers who fought and were killed for the Greek cause against the Bulgarians.

They were the most enthusiastic makedonomachi.I guess they ll turn in their graves ..if their grandchildren (who have Greek as mother language) refuse they are Greek.

[El Bre]

Most of the people you call Grecomans ,have lost grandfathers who fought and were killed for the Greek cause against the Bulgarians.

They were the most enthusiastic makedonomachi.I guess they ll turn in their graves ..if their grandchildren (who have Greek as mother language) refuse they are Greek.

Oh how romantic. Go stick your face back into a book and leave the history to those who acutally lived it.

People ratting out their friends and neighbours being turned into a noble endeavour. Now I've heard it all.

[toothpaste]

1.Oh how romantic. Go stick your face back into a book and leave the history to those who acutally lived it.

2.People ratting out their friends and neighbours being turned into a noble endeavour. Now I've heard it all.

1.You re too dazed of your nationalism ,so u see everything blurred.There was a nasty war these times..and victims suffered both sides.
If you believe your ancestors were pure as white pigeons..go on ,but you ll sound somehow between romantic and silly.

As for "those actually lived history" ,my great grandfather was assassinated by locals of the Exarchy (my grandfather called them "Bulgarians") in the beginning of the 20th cent.
My family also suffered during the occupation of Eastern Macedonia by the Bulgarians in WWI (1916) and WWII (1943)...counting 2 more victims.

You know...there are not any pure and innocent nations.

2.Some of these people you re talking about(slavophone Greeks or Grecomans or whatever) ,were tortured and preferred to die instead of denying what they wanted to self-determinate themselves-Greeks.

Does the right of self-determination exist only for you ?

[Risto the Great]

2.Some of these people you re talking about(slavophone Greeks or Grecomans or whatever) ,were tortured and preferred to die instead of denying what they wanted to self-determinate themselves-Greeks.

We have a deal.
They can call themselves Greek.
We will call ourselves Macedonian as we always have.

... But I wonder what they meant by "Greeks" when they fought for it.

[El Bre]

1.You re too dazed of your nationalism ,so u see everything blurred.There was a nasty war these times..and victims suffered both sides.
If you believe your ancestors were pure as white pigeons..go on ,but you ll sound somehow between romantic and silly.

I am the furthest thing from a nationalist you will find sir. I am about the 21st century rights of 21st century people.

My ancestors were millers and stone masons with going concerns. They had little interest in the politics of Greeks, Bulgarians or their patron states. When the time came to fight, they fought for the interests of Macedonia and Macedonians.

As for "those actually lived history" ,my great grandfather was assassinated by locals of the Exarchy (my grandfather called them "Bulgarians") in the beginning of the 20th cent.
My family also suffered during the occupation of Eastern Macedonia by the Bulgarians in WWI (1916) and WWII (1943)...counting 2 more victims.

Too bad that the people of Macedonia allowed themselves to be divided and conquered. My people also referred to Exarchists as Bulgarians. They called the Patriarchists Greeks. In most cases they were neither, just people like themselves buying into someone elses bullshit.

2.Some of these people you re talking about(slavophone Greeks or Grecomans or whatever) ,were tortured and preferred to die instead of denying what they wanted to self-determinate themselves-Greeks.

You mean they wouldn't swear their loyalty to the Exarchate. Don't get confused or you will force me to take out my violin.

Does the right of self-determination exist only for you ?

Absolutely not. These people chose Greece over Macedonia and God bless them all. I rest assured in the knowledge that my people are the same people today as they were in 1912. We chose Macedonia.

If you believe your ancestors were pure as white pigeons..go on

Well come to think of it, I did have a great, great uncle who spent an unnatural amount of time with his sheep.

By the way Toothpaste. Were your people "Slavophone Greeks"?

[toothpaste]

We have a deal.
They can call themselves Greek.
We will call ourselves Macedonian as we always have.

... But I wonder what they meant by "Greeks" when they fought for it.

Deal.
You can call yourself whatever you like.When did i refuse that for you?

As for...what did they mean by Greek? I m not sure to tell you.Are you sure about what all people of the region meant by "Macedonian" in 1900's?

I already told you-some neighboring villages of my grandfather's village were "Bulgarian" at that times...in Macedonia.
Blurred period..

[Delodephius]

If it is blurred don't treat it as if it was clear.

[GREEKoccupiedMacedonian]

Deal.
You can call yourself whatever you like.When did i refuse that for you?

As for...what did they mean by Greek? I m not sure to tell you.Are you sure about what all people of the region meant by "Macedonian" in 1900's?

I already told you-some neighboring villages of my grandfather's village were "Bulgarian" at that times...in Macedonia.
Blurred period..

Are you sure that they were Bulgarian?

[toothpaste]

Are you sure that they were Bulgarian?

They self-determinate themselves so,and that s enough for me.

[Daskalot]

Deal.
You can call yourself whatever you like.When did i refuse that for you?

As for...what did they mean by Greek? I m not sure to tell you.Are you sure about what all people of the region meant by "Macedonian" in 1900's?

I already told you-some neighboring villages of my grandfather's village were "Bulgarian" at that times...in Macedonia.
Blurred period..

Greek=Patriarchist
Bulgarian=Patriarchist

So you wonder what they meant, I can actually tell you, it meant that they were not Bulgar, Serb or Greek, only Macedonian, would you like to see the quote?

[toothpaste]

By the way Toothpaste. Were your people "Slavophone Greeks"?

No. Greek-speaking Greeks.

[toothpaste]

Greek=Patriarchist
Bulgarian=Patriarchist

So you wonder what they meant, I can actually tell you, it meant that they were not Bulgar, Serb or Greek, only Macedonian, would you like to see the quote?

My village's ppl don't remember any Macedonians.Just Greek(Ellines) ,Bulgarians(Voulgari) and Turks (Turki).

[Delodephius]

So they claim.