United Macedonia Diaspora

[julie]

Screwdriver and brandy
You both come onto this forum and put down everyone that posts here. What you don't seem to understand this forum allows the Macedonian diaspora to be heard, their concerns, and has been a fantastic medium in publishing facts our historians are negligent in. No questions are answered and you attack everyone here, both of you dont know how to answer any questions posed to you and attack the integrity of our members.
The administrators have done a fantastic job in developing this medium for us, and it affords us the means of presenting facts and the truth, and our voice is heard.
The MTO has the integrity to continue to allow UMD to post here, and advertise the parties and hero awards that you hand out to people that are not deserving of such an honour.
The UMD has not responded as an organisation to our concerns, for we are the Macedonian diaspora, the voice of the people, that endorse the Framework Agreement and endorse prefixes and suffixes to our name, all detrimental to the continuance and survival of our very existence, for the Macedonian Cause.
You come here and attack forum members with bravado, and most of our identities here are known, yet you hide behind your PC and applaud the bravado behind the endorsement of the erosion of our identity by attacking the very people that are fighting to keep it.
I dont think much of either of your characters, at least Meto has not been as rude and arrogant in personal attacks, perhaps he should take you both aside because you both are not doing your organisation any favours, the MTO is far reaching, and I know there are many people that do read here.
SoM has allowed the UMD the privilege to continue advertising here with their huge signature blocks, and perhaps you should both hang your heads in shame, because you are further adding to my continued disgust of the integrity of your organisation as am sure others are getting quite sick of it.
How about answering the questions posed to you, that is , if you can, isn't transparency and honesty something that should be upheld by your organisation?
It disgusts me, this continuing attack on my fellow forum members who are fighters for the Macedonian cause. Their is no hidden agenda here, or ego, nor anyone with self serving interests.
It also further makes me despisae what your country aspires to, the erosion of the Macedonian people's very name and identity. Your organisation promotes it, with the endorsement of the framework agreement , the endorsement of name change for entry into EU and NATO, because they are your US led big boy clubs. Your country is the one that destabilised RoM, with your support. Why would you want to do this to a nation of people, sellout your own blood, just to gain a seat in your bullshitter's US congress and country with your agendas.
I suggest you both crawl back into that hole you came out of , it really pisses me off more, as am sure it does others, to be put down continually, remember this
WE ARE THE MACEDONIAN DIASPORA AND THE MTO IS THE VOICE OF THE MACEDONIAN DIASPORA.
now blubber off you pair of alcoholics, because your ramblings and attacks are obviously under the influence

[Vangelovski]

Originally Posted by UMDiaspora.org

UMD Meets with MP Bryon Wilfert (Richmond Hills, Canada)

http://bryonwilfert.ca/?q=content/un...onian-diaspora

Groundhog day...new page, same BS.

Guy's, I think that from now on, everytime we meet with anyone, Ministers, MP's, Councilors, restuarant owners, rich people, poor people, regardless of what you're talking about, make sure you have your photo taken with them so you can post it here. Please also include any emails, letters and "press releases" you happen to write during your daily activism.

Meto, in his naivety (and his followers in theirs), seems to think he's the only one on this planet lobbying policy makers. Its as if no other activist does this. He seems to forget that photo's and marketing is not what counts, but rather the message that he's promoting.

[Risto the Great]

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Groundhog day...new page, same BS.
He seems to forget that photo's and marketing is not what counts, but rather the message that he's promoting.

No, there is a new message .... no negotiation on identity. It happened recently. Since then, they appear to have gone underground. What does an organisation do if it promotes "no negotiation" .... it gets the message out at every opportunity. Where are the speeches in front of dignitaries with Meto banging his fist on the table demanding an end to this embarrassment. It might even win him some credibility with people that matter.

[julie]

Vangelovski, if that was the case, this forum would be full of ego trippers, and full of photographs, when we lobby here, we don't take out cameras and have pretty photo shoots, we all do it without ego.
These boat trips and parties, do the UMD members realise are financing a luxurious lifestyle?

[julie]

RTG, you are correct, absolutely, they were big on travelling world wide promoting prefixes to the Macedonian name. Why is the UMD not doing what the AMHRC has done, promoting NO NEGOTIATIONS with their billboard campaign?

[Mr Brandy]

Originally Posted by Risto the Great

I think I agree with you. However it begs to be mentioned that they often give the impression of being involved in a whole lot more things than they actually are.

Agreed. And giving impressions will only get them ( or anyone ) so far and I think we can have faith that the truth will always come out in the end.

[UMDiaspora.org]

UMD Meets Canadian National Defence Minister Peter MacKay

Read full press release: http://umdiaspora.org/content/view/508/1/

[Mr Brandy]

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Groundhog day...new page, same BS.

Guy's, I think that from now on, everytime we meet with anyone, Ministers, MP's, Councilors, restuarant owners, rich people, poor people, regardless of what you're talking about, make sure you have your photo taken with them so you can post it here. Please also include any emails, letters and "press releases" you happen to write during your daily activism.

Meto, in his naivety (and his followers in theirs), seems to think he's the only one on this planet lobbying policy makers. Its as if no other activist does this. He seems to forget that photo's and marketing is not what counts, but rather the message that he's promoting.

Vangelovski - I would like to humbly challenge you here. While I agree with you that the message being promoted is of uptmost importance why discount "photo's and marketing" as you say.

I notice from many posters that there is a general disdain for marketing photos and self-promotion. It's described as almost being shameful.

Let's forget UMD for a second - can you honestly say that the Macedonian organizations that you support are doing an adequate job promoting themselves and their hard work? Can there not be more effort put into promoting the good works that you do and getting the message out there? I think everyone here can agree promoting the Macedonian cause is an inherently political endeavour. Don't skilled and successful politicians have the gift of self promotion.

What I keep hearing from non-Macedonians that have a better then average understanding of our cause is that we don't promote our issues enough. Therefore I argue that we need more salesmanship and marketing - not less. The "Our name is our name" billboard campaign currently run by MHRMI/AMHRC is a perfect example of what I am talking about - more of this is needed not less. We need campaigns like this happening everywhere we need to promote our cause.

I would love to read the stories and your activists lobbying policymakers. I don't think UMD is the only group that does this however I think you have to admit they do a good job at promoting themselves - I don't see this as a negative.

[Pelister]

I think its worth posting this very important information in a separate thread, and made a sticky because it shows the terms and conditions that have been IMPOSED on the Macedonians, and the kinds of things UMD have been supporting over the years.

Originally Posted by Tom

By supporting the Interim Accord and the Framework Agreement, this is what UMD is in favour of:

The full text of the Interim Accord (from the UN database) can be found here:

http://untreaty.un.org/unts/120001_1...3/00004456.pdf

Key Articles in the Interim Accord which Undermine Macedonian Sovereignty

a) Macedonia agrees to negotiate over its name (Article 5);

b) Macedonia agrees to renounce all claims to its ethnic/historic territory and agrees NOT to pursue the rights of Macedonians not only in Greece but in ANY OTHER STATE (Article 6);

c) Macedonia agrees to renounce the Sonce as its national symbol AND any other symbols that Greece considers to be part of its historic or cultural heritage (Article 7);

d) Macedonia agrees to only enter international organisations under FYROM (Article 11); and

e) Macedonia agrees that the two parties will not “resolve” the name dispute through the International Court of Justice (Article 21).



The full text of the Framework Agreement can be found here:

http://faq.macedonia.org/politics/fr..._agreement.pdf

Key points in the Framework Agreement:

The Framework Agreement makes Macedonia:

a) a multi-national state – effectively, any minority that can muster 20 per cent of the population becomes a constitutive nation. Theoretically, Macedonia can become a nation-state of up to five nations. Further, Macedonians themselves could lose constitutive nation status if their proportion of the population fell below 20 per cent;

b) a multi-lingual state – currently, Macedonia has two official languages and this could go up to five. Theoretically, Macedonian could also lose its official status;

c) a multi-religious state – official status has been provided not only to Christianity, but Islam as well, making Macedonia (in part) an Islamic state.

d) a racist state – with the Badinter principle (certain laws need a majority of parliamentarians and a majority of ethnic minority parliamentarians to pass), Macedonia provides undue veto power to a minority of citizens based solely on their ethnicity. Further, the Framework Agreement provides state employment to citizens based on ethnicity rather than merit;

e) a segregated state – rather than integrating minorities into the Macedonian mainstream, the Framework Agreement only further segregates the population by allowing ethnic minorities to develop politically independent of the mainstream (and of each other) without reciprocal civic responsibilities towards Macedonian society as a whole. This is particularly evident in how ethnic Albanians have refused to learn Macedonian, citing the Framework Agreement, and integrate into mainstream society. The decentralisation process (based along ethnic lines rather than economically-sustainable districts) has resulted in ethnic “enclaves” where minorities are becoming more segregated (politically and culturally) rather than integrating into wider society.

The Framework Agreement was a capitulation to extremists who engaged in terrorist acts. These extremists have now been guaranteed political power and positions in state institutions and security structures.

There are foriegn forces trying to destroy us and UMD has been right behind them from the very beginning.

[julie]

Mr Brandy, do you support name negotiations? Do you support the enforcement of the Ohrid agreement?
The concern here is what UMD is promoting. We dont need to promote boat trips and award hero awards to politicians that SHOULD be acknowledging our identity as our basic right to our existence as a nation.
I am so proud of the AMHRC, who work tirelessly for our cause, and they get the message across without pretty photographs of themselves.
What is it that UMD are promoting?
And stop knocking the people that post on this wonderful forum, who are privately lobbying, without the need for ego and glory.
We are so lucky here to be heard, we are the diaspora and these are our concerns