United Macedonia Diaspora

[Pelister]

Just in case people are not getting the message about UMD here it is again. (I should start releasing these UMD statement outside these forums).

President of UMD Meto Koloski said this:

"Macedonia HAS TO JOIN THE E.U UNDER A MODIFIED NAME"

Source: UMD President on Macedonian Media Monitor, http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Macedonia ... sage/10565
13 March 2008

It does not get much clearer than that.

UMD have not only called for a name change, and supported Greece fully within the framework of the negotiations, and supported the Greek position - UMD have set about trying to revise the history of our people, our identity and our culture and have tried to silence many good Macedonians who believe they are the descendants of the ancient Macedonians.

[UMDiaspora.org]

Pelister, do you want a medal? We believe you've set the Guiness on attacks on UMD and Meto Koloski.

What is wrong with MPO joining the Coalition? If they want to help increase the number of counted Macedonians in the Census, that's fine with us. Check out MPO's website, they posted the same press release: http://macedonian.org/media/census2010.asp Do they write anywhere that people should report "Bulgarian" on the Census? No! The Macedonian Orthodox Church is technically a part of the Coalition, as the Bishop gave his blessing. Does that mean the MOC is in bed with MPO? Give it a break. You have nothing better to do than make up BS.

Pelister - form your own organization and do some work. We need more active organizations in the world, Macedonia can use all the help it can get. Ajde da vidime sto mozes da napravis osven kritiki da davas? Ne ni treba baba zhabi, ni treba rabota.

[UMDiaspora.org]

The attacks on UMD have increased since it announced UMD President Meto Koloski will be in Australia in February, especially by this Pelister/Paul. What are you so afraid of? Unity? This person has compared UMD to the likes of Greece in numerous of his postings. We'll let readers of this Forum and the Maknews.com Forum make up their own minds.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Pelister, while there is no doubt that Meto advocated a name change and certain other comments from the UMD board members were undesirable, I don't think their ideology is anti-Macedonian.

They made mistakes, everybody does. The problem here is, nobody from the UMD has acknowledged these mistakes, their overall cause is not a mistake however.

As for the MPO, they are a Macedonian organisation that have been infiltrated with pro-Bulgarian propaganda from the beginning, but I have seen changes in them. However, and this question is directed at UMDiaspora - Has the UMD made a formal request from Alusheva and co. to drop the pro-Bulgarian garbage that still seems to remain as residue in a few segments of their website?

If not, I would like to know why. This all ties back to having a common and defined Macedonian cause, and there is no room for chauvanistic anti-Macedonian propaganda in the Macedonian cause.

[Soldier of Macedon]

This person has compared UMD to the likes of Greece in numerous of his postings. We'll let readers of this Forum and the Maknews.com Forum make up their own minds.

Both of you are guilty of such accusations towards each other, which goes to show the level of immaturity some of the arguments have descended to.

[UMDiaspora.org]

Again Pelister's BS. Where has UMD tried to silence many good Macedonians who believe they are descendants of the ancient Macedonians? See UMD's letter to the President of Greece regarding ancient Macedonians, that Risto Stefov helped us draft:

http://www.maknews.com/html/articles/koloski/letter_to_papoulias.htm

[UMDiaspora.org]

Mpo

Pelister, while there is no doubt that Meto advocated a name change and certain other comments from the UMD board members were undesirable, I don't think their ideology is anti-Macedonian.

They made mistakes, everybody does. The problem here is, nobody from the UMD has acknowledged these mistakes, their overall cause is not a mistake however.

As for the MPO, they are a Macedonian organisation that have been infiltrated with pro-Bulgarian propaganda from the beginning, but I have seen changes in them. However, and this question is directed at UMDiaspora - Has the UMD made a formal request from Alusheva and co. to drop the pro-Bulgarian garbage that still seems to remain as residue in a few segments of their website?

If not, I would like to know why. This all ties back to having a common and defined Macedonian cause, and there is no room for chauvanistic anti-Macedonian propaganda in the Macedonian cause.

MPO has been showing some improvements. The President of MPO, Andrea Alusheff, through her contacts had the Macedonian Flag flown over the City Hall of Cleveland for three days around September 8th. Here are the photos: http://www.clevelandpeople.com/group...donia-2009.htm Check out the second to the last picture with the Sun of Kutlesh.

MPO has been definitely infiltrated by Bulgarians or Bugaromani for its 90 years of existence, and its Toronto and New Jersey chapters are still quite Bugaromani.

UMD cannot answer for MPO, as MPO is its own organization, however, UMD in an effort to unite all Macedonian-Americans for the Census, invited MPO to participate. MPO's President attended the UMD Global Conference. There has been some improvement for sure. We do not want a 90 year old organization (whose initial founders and large part of their membership were/are Macedonian) to go down the drain or in the hands of Bulgarians. There are many internal struggles within the organization. You can contact their President to learn more if you want.

[UMDiaspora.org]

SoM

Both of you are guilty of such accusations towards each other, which goes to show the level of immaturity some of the arguments have descended to.

We disagree, but you have your opinion. UMD has shown above and beyond maturity but every single thread on every single forum is being taken over with this character Pelister/Paul's false accusations. UMD has never called for a name change, never, and it never will, PERIOD.

As far as MPO, UMD is trying to work with few people within MPO to turn it fully in the Macedonian organization it needs to be. There is a lot of infighting in the organization, and Andrea Alusheff got a lot of heat from some of their Bugaromani for joining UMD in the Coalition. But she fought and won. They have a lot of work to do but they are hopefully going in the right direction.

[UMDiaspora.org]

Any Macedonians on this forum born in Greece who do not have their Greek citizenship? If so, we encourage you to apply and see what the Greek government response will be. If they refuse, then a lawsuit should be brought against the Greek government.

[TrueMacedonian]

Israel's Proclamation of Independence, issued May 14, 1948, also invited the Palestinians to remain in their homes and become equal citizens in the new state:

I think people should read a book called "The Invention of the Jewish People" by Shlomo Sand. Professor Sand breaks down the myth of a "Jewish ethnicity" and the myth of a cultural continuation from biblical times to present. Remind you of someone?

YouTube - Shlomo Sand: 'There are Israeli, not Jewish people'

Israeli tanks demolishing Palestinian houses, Israeli army shooting at Palestinian rock throwers, Israeli Lobby in America that has lock down on the US government (for more on the Israel Lobby read the book The Israel Lobby written by 2 American professors John J. Mearsheimer, Stephen M. Walt).

Am I putting down all Israeli's and people of the Jewish faith? No. I do condemn the view that they feel that they have a right to a land they only occupied in the 20th century (reminds you of someone). I recommend the book by Shlomo Sand "The Invention of the Jewish People" because he also destroys the myth of 'hellenism'.

[UMDiaspora.org]

We have encouraged to the authors to update the "adresar" on a yearly basis and try to include more detailed info. on each organization in the Diaspora (i.e. mission statement, Board, objectives, etc...)

[Soldier of Macedon]

MPO has been showing some improvements. The President of MPO, Andrea Alusheff, through her contacts had the Macedonian Flag flown over the City Hall of Cleveland for three days around September 8th. Here are the photos: http://www.clevelandpeople.com/group...donia-2009.htm Check out the second to the last picture with the Sun of Kutlesh.

MPO has been definitely infiltrated by Bulgarians or Bugaromani for its 90 years of existence, and its Toronto and New Jersey chapters are still quite Bugaromani.

UMD cannot answer for MPO, as MPO is its own organization, however, UMD in an effort to unite all Macedonian-Americans for the Census, invited MPO to participate. MPO's President attended the UMD Global Conference. There has been some improvement for sure. We do not want a 90 year old organization (whose initial founders and large part of their membership were/are Macedonian) to go down the drain or in the hands of Bulgarians. There are many internal struggles within the organization. You can contact their President to learn more if you want.

You know what, I like Alusheva (Alusheff), she is one of the few leaders of the MPO that have fought against the pro-Bulgarian elements within the organisation, and she seems to be a good Macedonian lady.

I have seen some of the clips from MPO functions, dances, etc, they are not unlike any other Macedonian function, same songs, even the some of the more modern one's, naturally same dances and customs, everything is the same. They are Macedonians, unfortunately still trying to shake off the negative elements, but I hope they do succeed. The truth cannot be avoided, if the MPO was membered by Bulgars only it would have dropped the Macedonian element a long time ago, instead, it is dropping the Bulgar element. I am not saying the MPO should erase the prior history, acknowledge what has taken place, acknowledge where we went wrong there and why things were the way they were, and let's move on. The assistance that the UMD have provided as Alusheva and co. have worked to bring the MPO back into the Macedonian fold is to be commended, I hope they stay on the honest and straight path from here on and utilise their strength and potential for the betterment of Macedonia and the Macedonian people across the world.

We disagree, but you have your opinion. UMD has shown above and beyond maturity but every single thread on every single forum is being taken over with this character Pelister/Paul's false accusations.

It is not a matter of opinion, I have read both of your accusations against each other, on the forums, and on the digest. Both of you made basically the same or similar reference about each other as 'Greeks' or 'Grkomani'.

UMD has never called for a name change, never, and it never will, PERIOD.

Again, not a matter of opinion, on the ZMR interview Meto clearly advocates, as acceptable, for (1) a changed name with a "political modifier" for international organisations, (2) a changed name for bilateral dealings with Greece, and (3) the constitutional name to remain as is for internal and international use in dealing with other countries (should they choose to do the right thing).

That's on tape, and I am not putting any spin on it at all. Please don't insult my intelligence. Meto made a mistake, if he acknowledged it and moved on months ago, much of the talk taking place now would be a non-issue.

[Rogi]

Pelister, I believe that you are completely misrepresenting what was meant with

"Macedonia HAS TO JOIN THE E.U UNDER A MODIFIED NAME"

and you have taken those few words out from an entire sentence. The response I provided to you about the actual meaning of this choice sentence, is the correct one.

That is, that in the current circumstances it has become a reality that Greece has forced the EU to require a name change of Macedonia, if it wishes to join. That is a fact that we all know and recognise and the reason why most of us here want Macedonia to tell the EU where to go.

That is not a call for the name to change, it is an explanation of the current circumstances. Given the clear position AGAINST a name change, the logical conclusion is that it is a call to look at the 2 options available (end negotiations and seek alternative to EU, or lobby EU to give up its support of the Greek position and not require any name change, etc of Macedonia).

You shouldn't ignore that purely to keep these attacks up.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Rogi, am I misrepresenting the ZMR interview?

[UMDiaspora.org]

The interview by Za Makedonskite Raboti with UMD President Meto Koloski can be found here. YouTube - ZMR United Macedonian Diaspora - Macedonia Name

Please listen to the whole interview in its entirety; he mentions the illegality of Macedonia joining the UN under a name it did not choose. One should understand the interview was given during a time when Democratic Republic of Macedonia for UN/EU/NATO use only was on the negotiation table, proposed by Ambassador Nimetz. Macedonia's name was "technically" changed temporarily in 1993 to "the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia." Unfortunately, this temporary reference has stuck for much longer than the initial 6 months in the UN Security Council Resolution. The Macedonian Government, to our knowledge and based on our contacts, accepted this proposal Democratic Republic of Macedonia just as it accepted Republic of Macedonia (Skopje) few days before the NATO Summit.

The bottom line is we are spending too much time on a few words that can be misinterpreted regardless, all words can be misinterpreted, all said well over a year ago, when things were much different than today (when somehow our language and identity was also put on the negotiation table by the Greeks). UMD's positions have never shifted, and have been quite consistent. UMD will not accept a name change.

The question that should be asked, is how does Macedonia get out of this mess at the UN? What do we do need to as a global community to help Macedonia get out of this mess?