Macedonian-Turkish relations

[Onur]

Just so you know Shishe means bottle and Dzam means window

http://kurir.mk/makedonija/ekonomija...-vo-Makedonija

Ofc i know Prolet but "Cam" also means "glass" in Turkish as well as "window". You use both of the words in Macedonian? We write it like "Şişe, Cam". So, we have a separate letter "Ş-ş" for your "Sh" sound.

I saw from your link above, it says Şişecam is the world 4th biggest glass production company. I didn't know that.


Btw, is there any opposition for Turkish investments in Macedonia? I mean, is there any politician who says "Ottomans are coming back, we don't want Turks here"???

[Bratot]

Btw, is there any opposition for Turkish investments in Macedonia? I mean, is there any politician who says "Ottomans are coming back, we don't want Turks here"???

There is no opposition for Turkish companies or Turkish products, especially the Turkish alimentary industry, particularly the sweets,chocolates, crackers, chips etc. which are favored by Macedonians.

I haven't heard about any anti-Turkish politician in Macedonia.

[Bratot]

Turkey is getting back her positions in the Balkans


Official Ankara has almost equal interest in the Balkans and the Middle East. Interest in the Balkans based on the desire to support countries which once stretched the Ottoman Empire. Convergence to the Middle East, primarily aimed at economic plan to increase access to energy resources (energy corridor between Europe and Asia), which strengthens its role as a desirable ally.



Unconditional support for Macedonia

The fact is that there is reluctance among European structures in relation to Turkey, but the fact is that Turkey has managed to hold the lesson of the European Union when it comes to how to manage relations with neighbors and especially the Balkans, and manifesting of the Union that more knows it. Support that official Ankara has given the country, mainly qualified as sincere, friendly, unconditional.


- Macedonia receives strong political say unconditional, support from Turkey. From 2008 to formally document signed between the foreign ministers, relations have been uploaded to the level of strategic partnership - Korneti said.

She explains that this refers to support implementation of foreign policy priorities of the country for Euro-Atlantic integration, support for the constitutional name and the position and the affirmation of Macedonia in international organizations and the like.


The official Macedonian politics is a common assessment that "the cooperation between Macedonia and Turkey is a great level in all spheres."

- Sure, there is always room for deepening and intensification of cooperation, especially in the economic part - say the MRI.

On the other hand, shows a substantial association of Turkish citizens in our state, especially if they originate from Macedonia. In this context the fact that a significant number of those Turkish citizens are interested in again (as previously given up - during the move) Macedonian citizenship. Turkish immigrants in our region are also a strong lobby group that promotes and protects national interests in the country of Turkey but also in other countries of the world.

With its strong economic potential, Turkey is also ready to assist in the economic strengthening of Macedonia. However, except for investment in the Skopje airport no other. Login there, but aficionados of the conditions indicate that the country should turn to attract Turkish investment that will come primarily from small and medium enterprises.

http://novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=1212101956353&id=9&setIzdanie=22156

[Onur]

On the other hand, shows a substantial association of Turkish citizens in our state, especially if they originate from Macedonia. In this context the fact that a significant number of those Turkish citizens are interested in again (as previously given up - during the move) Macedonian citizenship. Turkish immigrants in our region are also a strong lobby group that promotes and protects national interests in the country of Turkey but also in other countries of the world.

Hmm, i didn't know that some of post-1950 immigrants from Macedonia are looking for regaining their Macedonia citizenship.

As far as i remember correctly from your posts here, i think there was a threshold of having above 20% population in the census results to be able to get special privileges according to your agreement with the Albanians in your country, am i wrong?

So why not ROM considers giving back Macedonia citizenship to these people in Turkey, since it`s allowed to have double citizenship in Turkey, so one can both have Turkey and Macedonia citizenship. You can call these people to apply for dual Turkish-Macedonian citizenship, then investigate their family members and grant citizenship only to the ones who doesn't have Albanians in their family and who wont vote for Albanian parties in Macedonia elections and deny the ones with Albanian heritage.

By doing this, you can easily drop Albanian population to drop below 20%. Also these people in Turkey were living in Macedonia for centuries anyway and i am sure some still have relatives living in there. I think already the ones who still has relatives in Macedonia demands to have Macedonia citizenship. I also think that they can create a good bridge between Macedonia and Turkey too cuz i don't think they can totally abandon Turkey anyway since they are living here for a long time and they have a life here.

[Risto the Great]

A worthy thought process Onur.

[DirtyCodingHabitz]

By doing this, you can easily drop Albanian population to drop below 20%

They were never above 20%. Turks, Bosnians, Roma and the torbeshi need to stop selling themselves out and stop voting as ethnic albanians.

[Onur]

A worthy thought process Onur.

Yes and these are just the first things came to my mind since you keep complaining about increasing Albanian influence in Macedonia.

Also doesn't Macedonian government have an initiative to call back Macedonian diaspora to Macedonia? Turkey has 75 million population but we still have programs like "your homeland awaits you" to get back people we lost in 1990s and these initiatives are working hard abroad by organizing conferences. The representatives of this initiative goes to the USA and try to convince intelligent Turkish people in there to work in Turkey by providing job contracts and easy loans to buy a house here.

Why don't you Macedonians abroad think about living in Macedonia?

Our motto for Turkish diaspora is something like; For how long you gonna serve USA, Canada instead of your own country and do you prefer to see your children share the same fate???

I think these words applies to you too, right?


In 1-2 years, these Turkish investment of factories, airports and hospitals will be opened and i am sure they would prefer to work with intelligent, educated people of Macedonian diaspora in Australia or USA, instead of Albanians of Macedonia. For example, my brothers wife is working in health sector here and i know from her that 100s of patients are coming to Turkey from Bulgaria(not counting Turkish people of Bulgaria) for some surgical operations because medical sector of Bulgaria sucks. Bulgarian health ministry have agreements with hospitals in Turkey and they are paying all the expenses for their citizens. I think the investors for these hospitals in Macedonia can divert some of these Bulgarian patients to there. So i think they wanna get patients from all over Balkans and they will surely need new personnel.

[Akzion]

Onur,
Is it true that Turkey has (or will have) naval military bases in Albania? Whatever hapenned with that story?

[Onur]

Onur,
Is it true that Turkey has (or will have) naval military bases in Albania? Whatever hapenned with that story?

Yes it is true. As far as i remember, Albanian parliament approved for Turkey to have naval base in their adratic sea coast. I think this was on the news in April or May this year. Few Turkish submarines and warships already gone to Albania and the military base will be build soon which includes about ~1000-1500 Turkish personnel at first phase.

I remember that Greeks was going mad about this since there will be a Turkish naval base right on the Greece`s ass. Is this still getting attention in Greek media?

[Akzion]

It grew some attention back then. From Greek point-of-view, this probably means that the area of Greek-Albanian borders (even close to Corfu) will be heavily militarized. Greek-Albanian relations have already been very complex eitherway.

[Onur]

this probably means that the area of Greek-Albanian borders (even close to Corfu) will be heavily militarized. Greek-Albanian relations have already been very complex eitherway.

You mean Greek army will relocate in to the Albanian border too?

Can i ask, for what purpose? You Greeks love to enter competition that you cannot win. Dont you see that your country went bankrupt because of this while making French an German military companies richer?

I wonder when Greece gonna decide to try other way around like acting modest and behave good to all your neighbors instead of entering some kind of rivalry with all your neighbors. Even tough Turkey and Greece are close to each other geographically, we are living in totally different conditions. You should do what you do best; focus on selling more of your olives, more of your tourism and brake more dishes in taverns and stop competing with Turkey in every area because you cant. Logic dictates this!


Can you imagine how it would be if Greece and Turkey would had friendly relations? Do you think you would be in economical crisis now, kissing German and French`s ass? because we would control whole mediterranean sea which means controlling all the energy sources and prevent any foreign power to have a word in middle-east. Also this would mean controlling all the gateways to Europe from east. Having whole mediterranean under control equals ruling the world for a century. Sometimes i think thats why Greece and Turkey hates each other because only this way western world can have a word here otherwise they couldn't. Their domination here depends on the people who hates each other.

[Bratot]

I have heard another Turkish-Macedonian military complex to be built in Macedonia, close Greek border.

I wonder what will be reactions after.

[Pelister]

I would welcome more Turks into Macedonia, because they are hardworking and loyal citizens of which ever country they live in. There are only two military powers which I believe should be operating at the invitation of the Macedonian government, in Macedonia, one Turkey and two, Germany (if Germany recognises Macedonia). If the U.S can have Camp Bond Steel in Kosovo, why can't Macedonia have a larger Turkish (and possibly German) military presence in its country, albeit on a temporary basis. Onur, I don't know if Macedonia has a program to lure Macedonians back - I don't think it has, that would require forward thinking and a plan for the future and at the moment the only thing the Macedonian leadership is capable of is whoring itself to people that want us exterminated.

[Prolet]

Ofc i know Prolet but "Cam" also means "glass" in Turkish as well as "window". You use both of the words in Macedonian? We write it like "Şişe, Cam". So, we have a separate letter "Ş-ş" for your "Sh" sound.

I saw from your link above, it says Şişecam is the world 4th biggest glass production company. I didn't know that.


Btw, is there any opposition for Turkish investments in Macedonia? I mean, is there any politician who says "Ottomans are coming back, we don't want Turks here"???

Onur, Sure

The owner from ShisheDzam is a Turk from Macedonia, nobody would complain at all its fantastic, as long as everything is done professionally and nobody gets ripped off i see it as something very positive. Turkey is a country that is on the rise and why shouldnt we be on the rise too? its good for everybody and the Turkish market is very big for our trade.

We say Dzam for window but we also have other words, for example Pendzer or Prozor can also be used for window and for glass we say staklo.

As far as i remember correctly from your posts here, i think there was a threshold of having above 20% population in the census results to be able to get special privileges according to your agreement with the Albanians in your country, am i wrong?

Why should they be any different to any other minority? The Ottoman Turks built so many monuments, the people who live in Macedonia speak our language crystal clear that you wouldnt know if they are Turkish or Macedonian where as the average ethnic Albanian would be easy to to figure out, even those who are in parliament cant speak our language properly. The point is every minority should be treated equally, the Albanians are just like everybody else in Macedonia however we all know what they want this is why they are not liked.

So why not ROM considers giving back Macedonia citizenship to these people in Turkey, since it`s allowed to have double citizenship in Turkey, so one can both have Turkey and Macedonia citizenship. You can call these people to apply for dual Turkish-Macedonian citizenship, then investigate their family members and grant citizenship only to the ones who doesn't have Albanians in their family and who wont vote for Albanian parties in Macedonia elections and deny the ones with Albanian heritage.

The law for citizenship in Macedonia is that Macedonian Citizenship is not a privilege its a right, you are either entitled or you are not. Just like we have Albanians from Kosovo demanding Macedonian Citizenship and all they have to prove is a few relatives in the mountains im sure the ethnic Ottoman Turks aswell as our Macedonian Torbeshi people who lived in Macedonia for over 600 years and left in the 1950s are entitled to citizenship just like any other Macedonian Citizens. The fact that these Turkish companies who are investing in Macedonia have roots from our country, they are doing something positive for our economy. MonteNegro was offering citizenships to anybody who would come to MonteNegro and invest over 300,000 Euros and they where heavily criticized by the EU.

In 1-2 years, these Turkish investment of factories, airports and hospitals will be opened and i am sure they would prefer to work with intelligent, educated people of Macedonian diaspora in Australia or USA, instead of Albanians of Macedonia. For example, my brothers wife is working in health sector here and i know from her that 100s of patients are coming to Turkey from Bulgaria(not counting Turkish people of Bulgaria) for some surgical operations because medical sector of Bulgaria sucks. Bulgarian health ministry have agreements with hospitals in Turkey and they are paying all the expenses for their citizens. I think the investors for these hospitals in Macedonia can divert some of these Bulgarian patients to there. So i think they wanna get patients from all over Balkans and they will surely need new personnel.

A Turkish Medical Group is currently building a Hospital in Skopje which specializes for Optical Medicine, now our citizens wont need to go to other countries for complicated eye surgeries. They are calling it medical tourism where tourists from other countries will come in and get operated on for a good price. Once we get proper facilities and equipment in our hospitals, im sure we'll be able to provide the proper health care for all our citizens aswell as those who live close to us. Alot of citizens from Kosovo and Southern Serbia are always in Macedonia for medical treatment. A few days ago our city hospital Sveti Naum (Gradska Bolnica) got state of the art equipment with new machinery and even dozens of baby incubators which were badly needed for the new born babies.

[Akzion]

Onur,
It is the Greek Navy that will be probably relocated, or some general plans and dogmas may change.
I believe we can handle some competition. We have to.
What do you mean "we are living in totally different conditions?"
Greece and Turkey (as a whole) control only Aegean Sea (excluding its' international waters), not the Eastern Mediterranean Sea. Also, don't forget British presence in Cyprus.