Tsar Samoil and the Archbishopric of Ohrid in Macedonia

[kykypajko]

the Exarchate Church was started in 1872, and you would have to understand the Ottoman Millet system and not apply your modern sense of nationality to a society that didn't have that concept

but what's the point of looking back when we have greater problems to solve

http://www.maknews.com/forum/general-discussions/petition-for-national-strategy-petitcija-za-narodna-misla-t20469.html

[Soldier of Macedon]

Because events in the past have dictated our current predicament, because having knowledge about our own history is a good thing. Your link is irrelevant to the topic.

[Pelister]

the Exarchate Church was started in 1872, and you would have to understand the Ottoman Millet system and not apply your modern sense of nationality to a society that didn't have that concept

but what's the point of looking back when we have greater problems to solve

http://www.maknews.com/forum/general...la-t20469.html

Completely irrelevent and out of left field, again. You havn't contributed a single thing of value to this thread. We were getting this kind of garbage from UMD followers a few years ago, looks like nothing had changed. FYI, nationalism in its modern form has been around since about the 16th century.

[Pelister]

Hey T.M.

This subject has fascinated me.

I found this interesting article in a 19th century British newspaper.

I'll just give you a bit of historical context. During the latter half of the 19th century, there was a movement among Bulgarians to break away from the oppression of the Greek clergy. The Bulgarians had sent petitions to the Porte for a separate Patriarch. At the same time articles had begun to appear in British newspapers (not many, but the number was growing), which misrepresented the demographic picture in Macedonia - these newspapers, usually guessed who was there, and the term 'Bulgarian' to describe Macedonians, began to find its way into the British public's imagination (over many decades). Now in 1860 a number of Bulgarians had got together (near the Danube) and put together another petition, but this time they had to justify why the Sultan should give them a Church of their own. The following article is interesting, because is talks about what the authors of this petition were saying, and the 'story' they had invented. The Bulgarians had never had a Church of their own, no civilisation to speak of so they appropriated the Macedonian one. This comes out in the article. There were a number of blatant distortions, and anachronism's in the Bulgarians 'story' and clearly they had taken Macedonian historical figures, and names, and replaced it with 'Bulgarian' to try an invent a theocratic tradition of 'their own'.

Here is the article.

The Morning Chronicle (London, England), Tuesday, August 7, 1860; Issue 29196

Turkey

The oppressive rule of the Patriarch of the Tanar has become so odious in the eyes of the Bulgarians, that they now unconditionally demand a complete separation from the Orthodox Community, and the appointment of a separate Patriarch. They claim this on the ground of its being merely a restoration of what they were unjustly deprived of about a hundred years since. Justinian who was a native of Bulgaria in the year 553 founded the Patriarchate of Oclinda, which existed uninterrupted until 1767, when, through the intrigues of the Ypsilantes family, the authority was transferred to the Constantinople Patriarch... TURKEY .

To get their own Church these Bulgarians had to present a historical case to the Porte - so they took our own civilisation, and our own Christian tradition, by changing the 'title' of people and the place.

[kykypajko]

Completely irrelevent and out of left field, again. You havn't contributed a single thing of value to this thread. We were getting this kind of garbage from UMD followers a few years ago, looks like nothing had changed. FYI, nationalism in its modern form has been around since about the 16th century.

hey how are the church lawsuits going down under? i hear aussie lawyers have racked in more money then the us lawyer over church disputes, is that true?

i'm starting to think that maybe the soros/crvenkovski/nazi/loch ness monster/zionist/masons are trying to divert our attention with a little church history and scandal

but since you've solved the whole name game i guess its ok to dabble in a bit of theological discussions

[julie]

pajko our name is not a game for us it may be for you . Australia is faring well financially thank you unlike your country cant wait till china calls in the debt ! Or will umd fund more boat cruises and hero awards with member based funds you tool . By the way congratulations on your first post not linking mak news , are you suffering withdrawal symptoms ?

[Pelister]

hey how are the church lawsuits going down under? i hear aussie lawyers have racked in more money then the us lawyer over church disputes, is that true?

Honestly, what has the Church dispute in Australia got to do with the topic of this thread? Again, irrelevent, and stupid.

[Risto the Great]

hey how are the church lawsuits going down under? i hear aussie lawyers have racked in more money then the us lawyer over church disputes, is that true?

i'm starting to think that maybe the soros/crvenkovski/nazi/loch ness monster/zionist/masons are trying to divert our attention with a little church history and scandal

but since you've solved the whole name game i guess its ok to dabble in a bit of theological discussions

Should we sit around a table and discuss these burning issues with you kykypajko? You sound like a real facilitator. What is your day job? Do you make hotdogs?

[makedonche]

Should we sit around a table and discuss these burning issues with you kykypajko? You sound like a real facilitator. What is your day job? Do you make hotdogs?

RTG
There's no need to insult hotdogs!

[TrueMacedonian]

hey how are the church lawsuits going down under? i hear aussie lawyers have racked in more money then the us lawyer over church disputes, is that true?

i'm starting to think that maybe the soros/crvenkovski/nazi/loch ness monster/zionist/masons are trying to divert our attention with a little church history and scandal

but since you've solved the whole name game i guess its ok to dabble in a bit of theological discussions

Kyky you seem to be bogging down alot of topics here with useless posts. You asked in an earlier post "but what's the point of looking back when we have greater problems to solve" and I'll tell you that the Macedonian church and its history and what happened to it a few centuries ago still resonates today.

I see that making a joke out of the Soros posts on here and on Maknews are becoming your staple. Pretty sad to see you rather prefer ignorance than help expose efforts to topple what is left of Macedonia - http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum...ead.php?t=4765

[kykypajko]

friedrich hegel said it best when he said
"the only thing we learn from history is we learn nothing from history"

what good is MTO's version of the "truth" when its hidden in some niche online forum? I would suggest that maybe you share your "truth" with people that can make a difference.

here's some examples: http://zionica.com/2010/11/19/groups...edom-advocacy/

or

http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/

what do you zealots think is a better use of time? bashing me for pointing out your waste of energy in posting in this topic OR working to stop discrimination against the MOC because of its ethnicity and not its teaching

[makedonche]

friedrich hegel said it best when he said
"the only thing we learn from history is we learn nothing from history"

what good is MTO's version of the "truth" when its hidden in some niche online forum? I would suggest that maybe you share your "truth" with people that can make a difference.

here's some examples: http://zionica.com/2010/11/19/groups...edom-advocacy/

or

http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/

what do you zealots think is a better use of time? bashing me for pointing out your waste of energy in posting in this topic OR working to stop discrimination against the MOC because of its ethnicity and not its teaching

Kykypajko
I think a better use of our time is getting more Macedonians aligned with the Macedonian Cause, as defined here at the MTO, and taking collective action once there is enough members to make an positive impact, rather than individual and small group activities having little or no impact by pointing out what we need to do with our time or where we are wasting it!

[Soldier of Macedon]

TM, any luck?

[TrueMacedonian]

Maybe by this weekend SoM.

[DimitarP]

Are there any other accounts of this battle?