United Macedonia Diaspora - Page 130

Vangelovski · 01-14-2010, 07:39 AM

Rogi,

Please do some basic research on constitutionalism and republicanism and then read the Macedonian constitution in light of that.

I know that you're an intelligent person, don't let apologists for the name negotiations blur your thinking.

Vangelovski · 01-14-2010, 07:42 AM

You want me to trawel through thousands of emails - many of which contain current UMD Board members arguing that a name change would be acceptable - to find the EXACT date I resigned. Isn't Jan/Feb 2008 good enough? What if I accidently post the wrong email on here?

Buktop · 01-14-2010, 07:42 AM

Thank you Rogi, at least some body here understands what is going on and has ACTUALLY READ the constitution...

Vangelovski, I gave you enough opportunity to read it for yourself, whether you let your hatred towards me blind your own judgment or whether you never actually read the constitution, I really could care less, but maybe you should learn to admit when you are basing arguments on personal opinion or actual facts.

Buktop · 01-14-2010, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Rogi,

Please do some basic research on constitutionalism and republicanism and then read the Macedonian constitution in light of that.

I know that you're an intelligent person, don't let apologists for the name negotiations blur your thinking.

Rogi quoted THE CONSTITUTION of the Republic of Macedonia, what more proof do you need? Are you that stubborn that you can't realize that your fight is with the wording of the constitution rather than the people who disagree with you?

Buktop · 01-14-2010, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

You want me to trawel through thousands of emails - many of which contain current UMD Board members arguing that a name change would be acceptable - to find the EXACT date I resigned. Isn't Jan/Feb 2008 good enough? What if I accidently post the wrong email on here?

I am just shocked that a co-founding member of UMD doesn't remember the date which he resigned from the position, especially given that it was only 2 years ago and that you haven't stopped talking about UMD's secret agenda ever since.

Risto the Great · 01-14-2010, 08:10 AM

C'mon Buktop, it really is not that shocking.
Why don't you ask Vangelovski precisely WHY he resigned rather than precisely WHEN?

Rogi · 01-14-2010, 08:12 AM

He resigned on Fri, Mar 14, 2008 at 9:57 AM, though that was just the end of what had been going on for months prior and perhaps years.

Internally among the UMD Board, there were many, many emails and discussions against almost every UMD press release, consistently, with the same arguments being made today. I recall that, despite the attempt, we never did get a clarification or clear response from everyone outlining clear individual positions.

I know why he left and I share his views and positions on Macedonia. Though I remained on the board until a few weeks ago, I did my best back then to convince Vangelovski to stay on the UMD Board and keep the balance.

Risto the Great · 01-14-2010, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogi

I know why he left and I share his views and positions on Macedonia. Though I remained on the board until a few weeks ago, I did my best back then to convince Vangelovski to stay on the UMD Board and keep the balance.

Thanks Rogi.
Buktop, where do you think the "balance" is now that 2 like minded people in Rogi and Vangelovski are now no longer involved with the UMD?

Buktop · 01-14-2010, 08:16 AM

Quote:

He resigned on Fri, Mar 14, 2008 at 9:57 AM

March 14 2008 is a month after the UMD bylaws were adopted and announced. Vangelovski has continuously claimed that he had no idea of the final bylaws, and also attempted to instigate problems in relation to UMD board member elections, WHICH are stated in the bylaws... Why has he repeatedly misrepresented UMD when he is fully aware of the finalized bylaws that were approved February 16, 2008?

Rogi · 01-14-2010, 08:17 AM

To be clear, I'm not agreeing with either side of this argument, purely because I'm out of my element here and just don't know enough; I am not a Constitutional Law expert.

The Constitutional Law professor in Macedonia with whom I have been in contact, believes the Government has the Constitutional power to do what it is doing - which should not be the case.

In quoting the Constitution above, the point I tried to make is that this argument does not seem so black and white, it seems rather subjective and from what I have been reading here, it could probably go either way in the Constitutional Court.

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01-14-2010, 07:39 AM	#1291
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,521	Rogi, Please do some basic research on constitutionalism and republicanism and then read the Macedonian constitution in light of that. I know that you're an intelligent person, don't let apologists for the name negotiations blur your thinking. __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

01-14-2010, 07:42 AM	#1292
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,521	You want me to trawel through thousands of emails - many of which contain current UMD Board members arguing that a name change would be acceptable - to find the EXACT date I resigned. Isn't Jan/Feb 2008 good enough? What if I accidently post the wrong email on here? __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

01-14-2010, 08:10 AM	#1296
Risto the Great Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Macedonian Colony of Australia Posts: 15,640	C'mon Buktop, it really is not that shocking. Why don't you ask Vangelovski precisely WHY he resigned rather than precisely WHEN? __________________ Risto the Great MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA "Holding my breath for the revolution." Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

01-14-2010, 07:42 AM	#1293
Buktop Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: NJ, USA Posts: 934	Thank you Rogi, at least some body here understands what is going on and has ACTUALLY READ the constitution... Vangelovski, I gave you enough opportunity to read it for yourself, whether you let your hatred towards me blind your own judgment or whether you never actually read the constitution, I really could care less, but maybe you should learn to admit when you are basing arguments on personal opinion or actual facts.

01-14-2010, 08:12 AM	#1297
Rogi Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,343	He resigned on Fri, Mar 14, 2008 at 9:57 AM, though that was just the end of what had been going on for months prior and perhaps years. Internally among the UMD Board, there were many, many emails and discussions against almost every UMD press release, consistently, with the same arguments being made today. I recall that, despite the attempt, we never did get a clarification or clear response from everyone outlining clear individual positions. I know why he left and I share his views and positions on Macedonia. Though I remained on the board until a few weeks ago, I did my best back then to convince Vangelovski to stay on the UMD Board and keep the balance.

01-14-2010, 08:17 AM	#1300
Rogi Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,343	To be clear, I'm not agreeing with either side of this argument, purely because I'm out of my element here and just don't know enough; I am not a Constitutional Law expert. The Constitutional Law professor in Macedonia with whom I have been in contact, believes the Government has the Constitutional power to do what it is doing - which should not be the case. In quoting the Constitution above, the point I tried to make is that this argument does not seem so black and white, it seems rather subjective and from what I have been reading here, it could probably go either way in the Constitutional Court.

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