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-   -   Macedonia & Greece: Name Issue (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1556)

Risto the Great 06-29-2018 02:33 AM

"the Hellenic inheritance from the ancient part of history."
....

This will be right up there with the "we are Slavs" comment in years to come. Disgusting prick.

Pelagonija 06-29-2018 05:04 AM

Very sad.

If we are slavs then letís just merge with serbia or Bulgaria or both, why have a gay fake country called North Macedonia?

Oh Waite nobody stupid enough to vote for this prick in Serbia or Bulgaria, that will mean he would have to sacrifice his privileges.

I donít know about you guys, I donít want anything to do with this newly created vassal Slavic/Albanian state of North Macedonia.

Risto the Great 06-29-2018 05:27 AM

Ventilated and framed fyrom is just as bad.

Niko777 06-29-2018 09:03 AM

[QUOTE=Risto the Great;174764]"the Hellenic inheritance from the ancient part of history."
[/QUOTE]

Archaeological sites and ancient regions like Heraclea, Stobi, and Pelagonia will become "symbols of Greek friendship"

Tomche Makedonche 07-01-2018 09:34 PM

This is the type of article I would usually avoid posting, as it is just a racist opinion piece from the Greek Media, however I have chosen to this time because of some interesting statements in it.

As usual, all racial slurs have been edited and noted in [I]Italic[/I]

[QUOTE][url]http://www.ekathimerini.com/230227/opinion/ekathimerini/comment/south-africans-south-sudanese-macedonians[/url]

[B]South Africans, South Sudanese, ‘Macedonians’[/B]

If the [I]Republic of Macedonia[/I] fulfills all the commitments it made when signing the name deal in [I]Prespa[/I], northern Greece, it will become the fifth country in the United Nations with a geographical qualifier in its name: after South Africa, the Central African Republic, East Timor (also known as Timor-Leste) and more recently South Sudan, which gained its independence in 2011.

A look at their constitutions shows us that in all cases – all of them! – the name of the state is the same as that of the people: “We, the People of South Africa,” “Le Peuple Centrafricain,” “We, the People of South Sudan,” “Povo de Timor-Leste.”

The same is the case for citizenship and nationality, which is referred to, everywhere, as South African, South Sudanese, etc. It is taken for granted that the citizens of a state do not identify themselves purely on the basis of the broader geographical district in which they reside. Thus, the citizens of South Africa don’t refer to themselves as Africans as if that were the name of their country, etc.

This self-evident factor was lost in the deal signed between Athens and Skopje in the [I]Prespa[/I] lake district on June 17. The state will be called North Macedonia, but the people will not be known as “North Macedonians,” but as “Macedonians.”

On the surface, the agreement settles a problem that appeared in 1991 when [I]Macedonia[/I] became independent from Yugoslavia.

[B]In reality, though, it addresses an issue that dates back to the [U]19th century[/U] and concerns the ethnic identity of the Slavic-speaking Christian people residing in Macedonia.

One section [U]chose[/U] to be Greek, another [U]decided[/U] to become Bulgarian. The term “Macedonians” for the others who lived mainly in the area that went on to become a part of Yugoslavia started making an appearance [U]after 1913[/U]. That is when the notion emerged of a “Macedonian nation” that had been fragmented [U]between the three Balkan states that occupied parts of Macedonia[/U].[/B]

By adopting the name “Republic of Macedonia” in 1991, Skopje chose to propagate the notion and take ownership of the name of the entire geographical area. The [I]Prespa[/I] agreement achieved a change in the country’s name. This was, objectively, an accomplishment.

However, instead of the new name identifying the state in all of its public manifestations, as is self-evident, the agreement breaks that continuity. What Greece gained with the name change, it ceded by accepting the term “Macedonians.” Thus, one of the peoples of the geographical region of Macedonia has laid claim to the name that refers to the entirety of the people of that area.

The government justified the concession by saying that it could not encroach on the [I]Macedonian[/I] people’s right to self-determination. But the name of the citizens of a state – their citizenship/nationality – is not an issue of self-determination. It is a legal bond with the state.

The Greeks remaining in Istanbul or Gokceada (Imbros) are Turkish citizens however much they want to call themselves Greeks. Where they do have the right to self-determination is in regard to their ethnic identity. They are ethnic Greek Turkish citizens.

The fact that Greece failed on the issue of what the people of [I]Macedonia[/I] will call themselves is a [B]sign of a poor negotiation. It is not treason.[/B]

Unfortunately, we seem to be moving rapidly from the talk of collaborators of 2015 to talk of sellouts today – rhetoric that is stoked by the government’s incredible arrogance and smugness. And that is the kind of thing that leaves deep scars on a society.

[I]Angelos Syrigos is an associate professor of International Law and Foreign Policy at Athens’s Panteion University.[/I][/QUOTE]

Recognition of a distinct people residing in Macedonia prior to 1913?, who apparently [U]chose[/U] to either be Greeks or Bulgarians (and Macedonians)?, as a result of the occupation of the area by three Balkan nations?... Where did this Athenian get his education from?

Soldier of Macedon 07-01-2018 09:56 PM

[QUOTE=Tomche Makedonche;174856]Recognition of a distinct people residing in Macedonia prior to 1913?, who apparently [U]chose[/U] to either be Greeks or Bulgarians (and Macedonians)?, as a result of the occupation of the area by three Balkan nations?... Where did this Athenian get his education from?[/QUOTE]
And what if those three Balkan nations never interfered in Macedonia? Fake Greeks and Bulgars in Macedonia would be non-existent or insignificant minorities. Sometimes these idiots are so neck deep in their own lies that they don't realise when the truth slips out. As for the term Macedonians appearing only after 1913, these morons are either ignorant because their own schools lie to them or they know that Macedonians identified as such well before that (which is an undeniable fact) but deliberately lie to others.

Soldier of Macedon 07-01-2018 10:00 PM

[url]http://pretsedatel.mk/mk/2011-06-17-09-55-07/2011-09-03-11-36-59/5245.html[/url]
[QUOTE][B]Прием на делегација од Сојузот на здруженија на Македонците од Егејскиот дел на Македонија - ĄМакедон"[/B]

Четврток, 28 Јуни 2018

Претседателот на Република Македонија, д-р Ѓорге Иванов, денеска прими делегација од Сојузот на здруженијата на Македонците од Егејскиот дел на Македонија - ĄМакедон" и членови на секретаријатот на Петтата светска средба на децата бегалци. Изразувајќи благодарност за приемот, тие го информираа претседателот Иванов со тековните активности во однос на финалната подготовка и организација за Петтата светска средба на децата бегалци, што ќе се одржи на 30 јуни и 1 јули во Скопје и Катланово. На средбата, делегацијата изрази поддршка за ставот на македонскиот претседател во однос за Законот за ратификација на Спогодбата со Република Грција.

[B]Admission of a delegation from the Association of Macedonians from the Aegean part of Macedonia - "Macedon"[/B]

Thursday, June 28, 2018

Today, the President of the Republic of Macedonia, Dr. Gjorge Ivanov, received a delegation from the Macedonian Association of Macedonians from the Aegean part of Macedonia - "Macedon" and members of the secretariat of the Fifth World Meeting of Refugee Children, expressing appreciation for the reception, they informed the President Ivanov with the ongoing activities regarding the final preparation and organization for the Fifth World Meeting of Refugee Children, to be held on June 30 and July 1 in Skopje and Katlanovo. At the meeting, the delegation expressed support for the position of Macedonian President in relation to the Law on Ratification of the Agreement with the Republic of Greece.[/QUOTE]

Tomche Makedonche 07-02-2018 06:42 PM

[url]https://www.mia.mk/Mobile/en/Home/RenderSingleNews/289?newsID=134339285[/url]

[B]The whole world recognises our country after the name deal, says PM Zaev[/B]

Skopje, 2 July 2018 (MIA) - The name agreement has fulfilled the centuries-long aspiration of our predecessors to have our own country. Finally, we are a country recognized by the whole world. Our Macedonian language and Macedonian identity have been recognized and there is no more dilemma, stressed Prime Minister Zoran Zaev on Monday.

"Until now, we were FYROM, Former Yugoslav Republic. Humiliated wherever we went. An internal debate of whether our Macedonia will survive was always active. Today, there is no dilemma - the centuries-long aspiration to have our own country has been fulfilled," Zaev said responding to a question of an opposition MP during today's Q&A session.

Macedonian identity and Macedonian language, he added, are finally recognized. "This is a settled issue in Macedonia, but the final decision will be made by the citizens."

"After 27 years, Macedonia will have the chance to decide what kind of future it wants and what kind of future it wants for its children. Macedonia will survive, the country will be here even if the citizens support the name referendum," PM Zaev said accusing the opposition of spreading 'antagonism' asking VMRO-DPMNE: 'Why have you failed for 11 years to bring Macedonia into the EU and NATO?'

"Make up your mind, where do you want to go and only then you will help the citizens. I am pro-EU and NATO and I have wholeheartedly supported the deal with Greece and I'm prepared to assume full political responsibility."

Zaev's speech sparked fiery debate between the ruling majority and the opposition party in Parliament. ba/16:47

Tomche Makedonche 07-02-2018 06:46 PM

[url]https://www.mia.mk/Mobile/en/Home/RenderSingleNews/289?newsID=134339013[/url]

[B]Kambovski: Ivanov as president is obliged to sign laws, not to express personal views[/B]

Ohrid, 2 July 2018 (MIA) - The constitutional duty of the president of the state is to sign laws and treaties, which are adopted and ratified by the parliament and not to express personal views and interpretations, the academician Vlado Kambovski told reporters Monday in Ohrid where he participates in the Summer School of Natural Law organised by the Centre for Strategic Research within Macedonian Academy of Sciences and Culture.

Kambovski considers that countryís integration processes should not be hindered, which have been opened with the good neighbourly relations treaty with Bulgaria and agreement on name dispute settlement with Greece, which should be confirmed in a referendum and afterwards in the parliament and signed by the president.

Once the president accepts and swears in to obey the Constitution then it is normal that he should behave in accordance to such a commitment. If he, according to the Constitution, is obliged, then it is not a matter of free will whether he will sign or not the law, whether he will have such an attitude or position, his constitutional duty and therefore legal duty is to sign the law, Kambovski underlined.

He believes that the referendum could succeed and he is optimistic that there is a will for such an outcome among the political parties.

He also announces that the Centre for Strategic Research within Macedonian Academy of Sciences and Culture will organise in September a scientific conference at which solutions stemming from name deal will be clarified. sk/13:46

Risto the Great 07-03-2018 12:15 AM

Don't you just love it when Macedonians get all intelligent'n'all? Using big words and sounding progressive. I think they should all get shiny new suits, then lined up and then have their last words to a firing squad. Pathetic maggots.


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