[QUOTE=Vangelovski;178490]I haven't checked the weather today - is it raining euro's over there yet?[/QUOTE]

Zaev claims that the heavy snowfalls of recent days have delayed the mass planting of money trees...but they're coming...along with massive foreign investments, now that the name has been changed...the future's so bright, I gotta wear shades...:001_cool:

My thoughts since this whole saga began, has always been that this is all primarily about NATO. The EU is a peripheral issue to everyone else since it will be a decade before any of that will begin to be taken seriously.

In this respect, the most constructive approach for Greece is probably to go along with their military masters and ratify the accord. No doubt the power the accord grants the Greek state over the Republic is one of domination, the Republic will remain subservient to the will of the Greek state in which it can demand and manipulate whatever policy it chooses. Greece essentially has acquired control of a new territory to mould to its will across a number of spheres, it still retains the power to hold the state at ransom and implement further ideological policies to indoctrinate the populace without having to bare any liability. They will after all have plenty of time to water down the Macedonian identity to irrelevance by the time the EU comes to the party. Geopolitically it also consolidates a larger sphere of influence in the region making it a stronger player amongst its most immediate competitors. Its not an opportunity most countries would pass on in respect of what they conceive to be an opponent. It is an almost fairy tale situation for them.

The alternative, being to decline to ratify the accord, is to pursue a policy of destruction, essentially it would probably be the best way to go about the dissolution of the Republic. Whatever measures those ministers from DPNE thought they added is really irrelevant, the Albanians have had the smarts to place their chips in with the constitutional amendments and those amendments will not be retracted as they carry with them the Albanians invested interests. Any push back if Greece pulls out will not change the constitutional amendments going forward which may fracture Macedonian support for SDS. Albanians will try to enforce the new name and all that goes which could start the process of official federation and even war (well armed skirmishes). Russia will add their rhetoric to spur further anti NATO and anti EU sentiment and well the whole thing can dissolve with partitions becoming a viable proposition to put on the table. NATO would have a vested interest to ensure that the mess remains as a western protectorate and deploy a permanent peace keeping mission and we will end up with another Bosnia situation. From the Greek perspective, sure that will diminish the potential of their imagined northern threat but also risks further polarisation of the remaining Macedonian fracture emerging from the carnage who would likely as a result hold a greater fanatical ideology in respect of their identity then the current apathetical one shared amongst the population now. The result also means that they allow another competitor (greater Albania) to increase their sphere of influence in the region (as opposed to Greece increasing theirs) which will further isolate them in the region due to Albania’s natural alliance with Turkey.

Looking at those two possible paths, it would seem more favourable for the Greek state to ratify the deal now, complying with and allowing NATO to achieve their goal to secure “western” hegemony of the state, and then look to mould the republic to their will in the decades leading up to potential EU membership.

The only question is whether they can fight their entrepreneurial urge to demand more from the Republic before the parliament ratifies the deal. Its clear that any demand they force on the Republic at this moment, Zaev will accept and agree to in order to push it through before the Greek elections, its just whether there is enough time to close off any further amendments before the Greek elections as prolonging the deal may actually put it all at risk under a new government and make it fall apart resulting in the destruction scenario previously discussed.

Taking into account the Greeks proclivity towards malevolence, irrationality and stubbornness when dealing with Macedonians, not to mention their greatest weakness (their delusions of grandeur), It is very easily possible it can go that way. So I guess we’ll see whether the Greeks weaknesses or their rationale wins the day.

As for this Russia UN talk, I’m with Vangelovski on that one, this is nothing but Russia pissing in the wind, pathetically clawing for relevance before its legs finally collapse and its corpse is consumed in about 20 years.

[QUOTE=Phoenix;178492]Zaev claims that the heavy snowfalls of recent days have delayed the mass planting of money trees...but they're coming...along with massive foreign investments, now that the name has been changed...the future's so bright, I gotta wear shades...:001_cool:[/QUOTE]I'm sure the snow ploughs are on their way from Brussels.

The North Macedonians have been ploughed for ages.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;178483]Its among the amendments you posted for me the other day. It says that the amendments to the constitution (implementing the prespa agreement) go into effect only once Greece ratifies the agreement. But I don't remember reading that they are time limited. Greece could theoretically ratify the agreement in 10 years time and Macedonia will automatically revert from fyrom to North Macedonia. Ironically, should Macedonia actually end the negotiations and move on from this sordid affair, Greece could ratify the prespa agreement and Macedonia would end up with the taste of butt in its mouth...again. It would have to amend the amendments.

Who still thinks governments are qualified to run our lives?[/QUOTE]

I just went back to this. The bit about the amendments only going into effect once Greece ratifies the agreement were in the explanatory material - not in the actual amendments themselves - which means jack.

The amendments are in full effect now.

[IMG]https://sitel.com.mk/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/article/teaser-images/2019/january/dvnc61ixcamqmpq-205969.jpg?itok=uI9bLysw[/IMG]

Стојанче Ангелов: Отсега ќе бидете Македонци кога ќе одите на грчките плажи, а не Скопјани

[url]https://sitel.com.mk/stojanche-angelov-otsega-kje-bidete-makedonci-koga-kje-odite-na-grchkite-plazhi-ne-skopjani[/url]

[QUOTE=Pelagonija;178511]
Стојанче Ангелов: Отсега ќе бидете Македонци кога ќе одите на грчките плажи, а не Скопјани

[url]https://sitel.com.mk/stojanche-angelov-otsega-kje-bidete-makedonci-koga-kje-odite-na-grchkite-plazhi-ne-skopjani[/url][/QUOTE]Another pathetic loser.

What a sad individual.

[QUOTE=Tomche Makedonche;178493] NATO would have a vested interest to ensure that the mess remains as a western protectorate and deploy a permanent peace keeping mission and we will end up with another Bosnia situation. From the Greek perspective, sure that will diminish the potential of their imagined northern threat but also risks [B]further polarisation of the remaining Macedonian fracture emerging from the carnage who would likely as a result hold a greater fanatical ideology in respect of their identity then the current apathetical one shared amongst the population now. [/B]The result also means that they allow another competitor (greater Albania) to increase their sphere of influence in the region (as opposed to Greece increasing theirs) which will further isolate them in the region due to Albania’s natural alliance with Turkey.[/QUOTE]

Perhaps that what Macedonians really want deep down - to become like the Kurds, a people without a homeland. Perhaps we just really miss the 1890s through 1940s.

[QUOTE=vicsinad;178523]Perhaps that what Macedonians really want deep down - to become like the Kurds, a people without a homeland. Perhaps we just really miss the 1890s through 1940s.[/QUOTE]

Well it was a period where people tended to care about something more than just themselves, and oppression did seem to get people’s sense of priorities in order, as opposed to liberation, they really seem to struggle with that, they are rather completely lost in a liberated scenario.

Wait, did I just describe a kind of Stockholm syndrome?, just oppress us, at least we know what to do and how to act then.