Everyone has the right to freedom, we all know that but the cruel world we live in sees so many opressed people, too many. Why? because the world we live in is about power and not basic human rights. It's about being greedy, about selfish superpowers who for their own needs will do anything. I know who I am and no legal or illegal paper, actually no paper in the world can tell me differently, I am who I am and I will stay that way. I think I understand what Bratot is trying to say and I don't think in any way he is in denial about basic human rights, about what every individual on this planet has the right to. But in a way he is right, this is not about natural laws, or papers or anything, it is about power and we don't hold it. I IN NO WAY agree with any agreement that has to do with my name and my country because I signed nothing, I IN NO WAY agree with anything my country is being forced into but bigger powers at play can and will be forcing us. I have said it before and I will say it again, WE MUST pull out of any agreements and stupid things we are invloved that concern our name, us and our identity. But the people of Macedonia will suffer. However when you look at it now they are already suffering so they have nothing to lose.
In response to the original question Risto I bet you a large number of people in MKD don't have a clue what it is about. But than the people of MKD are fed so many lies it's never ending.

Firstly, don't pretend to understand international law. Secondly, no human law, international or domestic, can override natural law.

Really…in which world…heaven.

How can anyone prove you wrong when you don't accept the existence of some of our most fundamental laws, principles and concepts - the very issues at hand. You live in your own world.

Which world would that be…
the one where umpteen rigged election see the bad guy in power over the will of the people.

The one where you can just do drug running and human trafficking to get illegal hundreds of millions to buy guns.

Where you use those guns where you shoot innocent civilians and make them run for their lives from their homes and farms.

Where you can shoot at a SOVERIGN…hey there’s your favourite word…government and country and be called a freedom fighter and hero deserving of said government pension.

Where foreign nato troops come in to your SOVERIGN…hey there it is again…country to save the terrorists at the threat of blowing you up…ummmm isn’t that an invasion….

But we have NATURAL rights.

The eu and un…ie the invaders…even have it in their own laws.

[B]Ever hear the words Koj te sisa
What was that..No…you should get out more especially in RoM…I know they are very good at saying it there and I wasn’t even into ANY political rubbish.[/B]
ps...just tell them you are from the diaspora

You really come off as one of these late night Evangelical preachers…in the world we should all love one another…turn the other cheek…ect…maybe they are great principles yet everything we see around us is the opposite. They say heaven must be wonderful.

Thank goodness that devilish rogue Goce Delcev who called many Macedonians as "slaves", "thick" and "weak" helped to do something about it.

And after his ill timed 2 week adventure we all know how wonderful it turned out fo him and us Macedonians since 1903...even in the Yugo days when we had our own Republic…yeah… my families predecessors enjoyed watching their farming fields and cattle sheep ect be confiscated at gun point by armed soldiers…and lets all remember to say dolgo da zivej druze Tito.

Wake up and smell the liberty.
Wake up and smell the coffee.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;83023]Jankovska,

Macedonians have had relatively easy lives in comparison to many others in Africa, the Middle East and Asia who faced much more difficult challenges but never lost their resolve for freedom. Hardship, while understandable, is not really an excuse.[/QUOTE]

Vangelovski you haven't lived in Macedonia therefor you wouldn't know. The people of Macedonia have never had it easy, YOU HAVE so stop bullshiting me coz I am getting tired.

[QUOTE=makedonche;83027]Jankovska
The constant attack on our identity, religion, political structure from external sources (Greeks, Bulgarians, Serbians, UN, NATO, EU) continually causes identity problems and doesn't allow the ordinary Macedonian to be "oneself" or the country to be "itself", they have very cleverly implimented a plan of denationalisation and regular interference in our religious institutions, political institutions, educational insitiutions and social fabric, and continue to do so to this very day. We in the diaspora are very fortunate to be able to stand back and view this from a distance and from a perspective of certain objectivity. The most difficult part for me is watching this happen and not being able to do enough constructively to help the Macedonians in the Republic. Having said that the Macedonians in the Republic need to do more to help themselves, it seems like there is too much willingness to accept what is being handed out, there doesn't seem to be enough free will to "be oneself" or for the country to "be itself", your thoughts?[/QUOTE]

True but this problem is not from yesterday, it's centuries old. People have been under different occupation, people have been beaten, tortured, or just gone. This is something that has been happening for years and years, it won't change over night. And it is harder because of the situation the Macedonian person finds themselves on day to day basis. It's all well and nice for you and me to talk and I AGREE it's just I feel they have been beaten for too long to just raise their heads staight away, they are still being beaten and betrayed. It will happen, we just need to hope not to late.

Bratot,

Please do help me with my interpretation of Article 8, which is about the right to personal privacy. In fact, I'll post it here:

[quote]


Article 8 – Right to respect for private and family life[LIST=1][*]Everyone has the right to respect for his private and family life, his home and his correspondence.[*]There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right except such as is in accordance with the law and is necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security, public safety or the economic well-being of the country, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others.[/LIST][/quote]Bratot - at least do a basic google search on natural law and self-determination. For someone who wants the complexities of the 'nuts and bolts', you're having an impossible time with the most basic foundations.

OziMak,

Its good to see you're irrelevant rants again, though, I'm not sure if you're quoting RtG and myself or using our arguments against yourself???

[quote=Jankovska;83033]Vangelovski you haven't lived in Macedonia therefor you wouldn't know. The people of Macedonia have never had it easy, YOU HAVE so stop bullshiting me coz I am getting tired.[/quote]

How do you know whether I have lived in Macedonia or not, or how much time I have spent there or what I have done while I was there? What does that even have to do with the fact that Macedonians do have it RELATIVELY easier than other people across the world and that these others have not waivered in their resolve for freedom like the Macedonians have?

[QUOTE=OziMak;83032]And after his ill timed 2 week adventure we all know how wonderful it turned out fo him and us Macedonians since 1903...even in the Yugo days when we had our own Republic…yeah… my families predecessors enjoyed watching their farming fields and cattle sheep ect be confiscated at gun point by armed soldiers…and lets all remember to say dolgo da zivej druze Tito.

Wake up and smell the liberty.
Wake up and smell the coffee.[/QUOTE]

OM, I am not even sure where your frustrations lie. But would you agree that Goce remains a symbol of freedom and liberty for Macedonians? Would you agree that 2 weeks (or whatever minutes) of liberty left quite a mark on the Macedonian psyche?

Imagine someone who got 3 weeks (or more) of true liberty for Macedonians.

[QUOTE=Jankovska;83034]True but this problem is not from yesterday, it's centuries old. People have been under different occupation, people have been beaten, tortured, or just gone. This is something that has been happening for years and years, it won't change over night. And it is harder because of the situation the Macedonian person finds themselves on day to day basis. It's all well and nice for you and me to talk and I AGREE it's just I feel they have been beaten for too long to just raise their heads staight away, they are still being beaten and betrayed. It will happen, we just need to hope not to late.[/QUOTE]

Jankovska
Yes, we tend to forget how long the Macedonians have been suppressed and underestimate how long it will take to overcome this indoctrinated subservience! You are right - it will happen, we will never give up hope, the fact that we are discussing it and acknowledge it shows that it's not too late, my wish is for it to happen faster!

[QUOTE=Risto the Great;83039] But would you agree that Goce remains a symbol of freedom and liberty for Macedonians?

Would you agree that 2 weeks (or whatever minutes) of liberty left quite a mark on the Macedonian psyche?
[/QUOTE]Answer to the first question "Yes"

Answer to the second question "Yes" again. It must have if we still talk about it today. :macedonia

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;83035]Bratot,

Please do help me with my interpretation of Article 8, which is about the right to personal privacy. In fact, I'll post it here:

[/QUOTE]


Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights includes the right to a name or identity as well.