Vangelovski, UMD lobbied very hard in North America and i think they are on the right track here in Australia. An office in Canberra is a step in the right direction, the Embassy is there so they can work together.

What in your opinion is the best way to tackle the name issue? Do you think its better for us here to be throwing mud on eachother or do you believe that we should be lobbying with the Australian MP's for support?

UMD lobbied hard for what?

Prolet, I think you should become UMD's spokesman.

[quote=MP_MK;38561]While you guys argue amongst youselves, there is a national and international campaign that is being led by a Greek MP, which is gathering huge momentum as we speak.[/quote]

MP, how about you continue on your merry way with your own "international campaign" with those 3 leading Australian Macedonian representatives. From what you've told us on this forum, there's no stopping you. Or, you could provide some useful information.

Vangelovski, To raise awareness for the Macedonian Cause, many Americans knew very little about Macedonia.

Now how do you suggest we tackle the issue regarding name recognition?

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38564]MP, how about you continue on your merry way with your own "international campaign" with those 3 leading Australian Macedonian representatives.[/QUOTE]



I knew you were Greek from the onset.

[quote=Prolet;38565]Vangelovski, To raise awareness for the Macedonian Cause, many Americans knew very little about Macedonia.

Now how do you suggest we tackle the issue regarding name recognition?[/quote]

Macedonian cause? How do you define it?

MP, What are your thoughts on tackling the Name Issue?

Oh come on Vangelovski you know what im talking about, we have 15 senators on our side thanks to the UMD. Dont you think that is a good achievement?

And now you answer me about tackling the name dispute, how do we do it in Australia? You ruled out opening an office in Canberra so whats a better way to go about it?

[quote=MP_MK;38566]I knew you were Greek from the onset.[/quote]

MP, we still don't know who you supposedly represent (if anyone) or who supposedly supports you (again, if anyone).

You've made some sweeping claims on this forum, yet you havn't managed to deliver anything extraordinary. Now you're making claims that some unnamed Greek MP is leading an "international campaign" on something. I suppose you're here to save the day again?

[QUOTE=Prolet;38568]MP, What are your thoughts on tackling the Name Issue?[/QUOTE]


Too little time to spare today to engage in a discussion about this, I'm afraid. Next time :)

[quote=Prolet;38570]Oh come on Vangelovski you know what im talking about, we have 15 senators on our side thanks to the UMD. Dont you think that is a good achievement?

And now you answer me about tackling the name dispute, how do we do it in Australia? You ruled out opening an office in Canberra so whats a better way to go about it?[/quote]

Prolet, I still think you should become UMD's spokesman. Maybe you could sit in their Canberra office and give us daily updates on which name they prefer at the time.

Vangelovski, Perhaps this might interest you

[url]http://www.maknews.com/forum/general-discussions/greek-food-outlet-gaganis-bros-in-south-australia-t18674.html[/url]

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38571]MP, we still don't know who you supposedly represent (if anyone) or who supposedly supports you (again, if anyone).

You've made some sweeping claims on this forum, yet you havn't managed to deliver anything extraordinary. Now you're making claims that some unnamed Greek MP is leading an "international campaign" on something. I suppose you're here to save the day again?[/QUOTE]



Definitely greek.

[QUOTE=Prolet;38565]Vangelovski, To raise awareness for the Macedonian Cause, many Americans knew very little about Macedonia.

Now how do you suggest we tackle the issue regarding name recognition?[/QUOTE]Prolet, UMD as an organisation is not the issue here. Its the people and policies behind it. Replace them, and we can have an UMD organisation that can cary on with full trust by everyone. This is not a new issue Prolet, you have been around.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38573]Prolet, I still think you should become UMD's spokesman. Maybe you could sit in their Canberra office and give us daily updates on which name they prefer at the time.[/QUOTE]


Vangelovski, You ruled out opening an office remember? Tell me how you suggest we tackle the name issue. How do we gain recognition? What is the plan, how do we achieve it etc etc

The UMD can only assist, the rest is up to all of us Macedonians who live in Australia.

MP, A brief opinion would be nice, no need to go into the specifics.

Bill, My only aim is for our community in Australia to get its house in order and then tackle the name recognition. We have our priorities as you are aware, if UMD is prepared to assist in anyway they are welcome. They wont be the ones steering the ship, you know that.

At least MP_MK is, as it seems, doing something other than go to war on the net. Even just one tiny article in one tiny local paper is better than spending 24h a day bitching on the internet about how others should work for Macedonia...

[QUOTE=Prolet;38578]Bill, My only aim is for our community in Australia to get its house in order and then tackle the name recognition. We have our priorities as you are aware, if UMD is prepared to assist in anyway they are welcome. They wont be the ones steering the ship, you know that.[/QUOTE]So you are sugesting in order to get our house in order, we need to open a UMD office in Canberra where USA branch will not be able to pull strings or have any influence at all. is this corect?

Mate, read the many posts again by Australian based UMD sympathizers who would most likely be part of it, and tell me again, Meto and the gang, will not have any influence or steer the ship as you put it.

Bill, We have a UMD Group in Australia lead by Ordan Andreevski, the name is not so important let it be called a UMD office as long as there are representatives from our major organizations like AMHRC,Community leaders etc Meto clearly stated that the UMD is not in Australia to interfere with other organizations it is only here to help.

I think a more important question is how do we gain name recognition from Australia.

[QUOTE=Prolet;38589]Bill, We have a UMD Group in Australia lead by Ordan Andreevski, the name is not so important let it be called a UMD office as long as there are representatives from our major organizations like AMHRC,Community leaders etc Meto clearly stated that the UMD is not in Australia to interfere with other organizations it is only here to help.

I think a more important question is how do we gain name recognition from Australia.[/QUOTE]



Despite what anyone says, I assure you that had of there been support from every angle on this Rann campaign, the name recognition would have been thrown back in the spotlight and open to official debate.

I am almost 95% certain that this once in a decade opportunity has been wasted.

I don't know about that, media spin on an issue that only the Macedonian community cares about is unsustainable anyway and just wont have that much of a far-reaching effect.

It's behind the scenes where the opportunity lies, and where it most definitely is not being wasted.

[QUOTE=slovenec zrinski;38583]At least MP_MK is, as it seems, doing something other than go to war on the net. Even just one tiny article in one tiny local paper is better than spending 24h a day bitching on the internet about how others should work for Macedonia...[/QUOTE]

THANK YOU! It is good to know that there are still reasonable people here on the forum!

[QUOTE=Rogi;38594]I don't know about that, media spin on an issue that only the Macedonian community cares about is unsustainable anyway and just wont have that much of a far-reaching effect.

It's behind the scenes where the opportunity lies, and where it most definitely is not being wasted.[/QUOTE]

I am sure the opposition and the voter base care very much whether their premier's are accused of racism, and inciting racial hatred... The strongest force you can have behind you are the voters.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38571]MP, we still don't know who you supposedly represent (if anyone) or who supposedly supports you (again, if anyone).

You've made some sweeping claims on this forum, yet you havn't managed to deliver anything extraordinary. Now you're making claims that some unnamed Greek MP is leading an "international campaign" on something. I suppose you're here to save the day again?[/QUOTE]

So instead of contributing to the Rann campaign, or investigating this Greek movement you would rather bitch about UMD and attack MP for doing something, what a miserable person you are...

[B]POLITICS 101:[/B]

If you want something to become a debate in politics- media and public outcry are your best friends.

Can I ask if you aware of the legal campaign on Rann? Do you think this campaign on Rann will bring the name recognition into the spotlight?

I assure you if there was a public out cry and the Macedonian Diaspora within Australia were networked correctly and on standby to act on command, then this would have blown out into the media. The opposition party would have not hesitated to use the mass outcry to their advantage, they would have moved quickly to secure the Macedonian vote and bring Rann to answer.

This is feedback I have received directly from the opposition and a number of Chief Producers on tv stations. The lack of Macedonian outcry and care on the matter is what makes it a non-event.

I assure you the name recognition would have been dragged into the spoptlight, if there was an out cry.

And Rogi: I understand you know politics, the lesson above was not directed at you, simply feedback I received first hand.

Prolet,

Judging from MP's 'extraordinary intellectual prowess', 'demonstrated experience' and 'connections in the media and Macedonia', I'm sure he's already devised a cunning grand strategy to have Australia recognise Macedonia. Further, I'm sure he's also got the support of ALL the Australian Macedonian organisations for whatever he has cooked up. All we have to do is sit back and watch it unravel.

[quote=Buktop;38598]So instead of contributing to the Rann campaign, or investigating this Greek movement you would rather bitch about UMD and attack MP for doing something, what a miserable person you are...[/quote]

Bucktop, until Danger Man reveals who this unnamed Greek MP is or the details of this "international campaign", I'm afraid our ability to "investigate" is limited, so we'll have to let him save the day.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38605]Prolet,

Judging from MP's 'extraordinary intellectual prowess', 'demonstrated experience' and 'connections in the media and Macedonia', I'm sure he's already devised a cunning grand strategy to have Australia recognise Macedonia. Further, I'm sure he's also got the support of ALL the Australian Macedonian organisations for whatever he has cooked up. All we have to do is sit back and watch it unravel.[/QUOTE]



Well that shouldn't be hard for you Vangelovski! You have proven your ability to sit back and watch.

Vangelovski, I asked for your opinion dont pass the ball to MP for this one. Im sure you have your own opinion and i would like to hear it.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38606]Bucktop, until Danger Man reveals who this unnamed Greek MP is or the details of this "international campaign", I'm afraid our ability to "investigate" is limited, so we'll have to let him save the day.[/QUOTE]

Vangelovski, he already did

[url]http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2768[/url]

[quote=MP_MK;38607]Well that shouldn't be hard for you Vangelovski! You have proven your ability to sit back and watch.[/quote]

Michael,

In you're own mind, your a real mover and shaker :) Too bad you still haven't managed to deliver anything extraordinary, which is exactly what we've come to expect with your posts on here.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38610]Michael,

In you're own mind, your a real mover and shaker :) Too bad you still haven't managed to deliver anything extraordinary, which is exactly what we've come to expect with your posts on here.[/QUOTE]

What do you expect him to do exactly? Lay a golden egg? How about you help him instead of being malicious? At least he helped get the stories published.

[QUOTE=Vangelovski;38610]Michael,

In you're own mind, your a real mover and shaker :) Too bad you still haven't managed to deliver anything extraordinary, which is exactly what we've come to expect with your posts on here.[/QUOTE]


What is your definition of extraordinary?

Thanks Buktop..I am actually totally amazed at all of this...stunned....When I read some of UMD:s or rather Metos opinions I too get hesitant about their opinion on the name issue etc etc..but this is just ridiculous. Instead of rallying around the cause, the actions that needs to be done right away, people spend seemingly the entire day here dissecting every little word from some people ad infinitum. Instead of helping with translations, time is spent with this "petty war" against some people that are doing something actively IRL....weird....extreme...

[quote=MP_MK;38615]What is your definition of extraordinary?[/quote]

Lets go with the Oxford Dictionary definition (according to mine) - unusual or remarkable; unusually great.

For all your boasting on this forum, what exactly have you delivered that is extraordinary, that no other activist (Macedonian or otherwise) has not done?

[QUOTE=slovenec zrinski;38629]...Instead of rallying around the cause, the actions that needs to be done right away, people spend seemingly the entire day here dissecting every little word from some people ad infinitum. Instead of helping with translations, time is spent with this "petty war" against some people that are doing something actively IRL....weird....extreme...[/QUOTE]

What IS "the cause" that we should be rallying around?

OUR BIGGEST ENEMY IS THE TRAITORS WITHIN OUR RANKS WHO ARE ABOUT TO SELL US OUT YET AGAIN AND YOU WANT US TO WORRY ABOUT SENSIBILITIES OF SOME RAMKOVIST MALAKAS.

Btw, nothing that really matters is being done by METO and his sidekicks except to divert attention from what really needs to be done and to drain Macedonian Diaspora of financial resources that should, and could, be better utilised to fight the TRAITORS within our ranks, especially in RM. In fact UMD is aligned with the Ramkovists and thus, IMO, it is also the enemy of the Macedonian people.

[QUOTE=indigen;38645]What IS "the cause" that we should be rallying around?

OUR BIGGEST ENEMY IS THE TRAITORS WITHIN OUR RANKS WHO ARE ABOUT TO SELL US OUT YET AGAIN AND YOU WANT US TO WORRY ABOUT SENSIBILITIES OF SOME RAMKOVIST MALAKAS.

Btw, nothing that really matters is being done by METO and his sidekicks except to divert attention from what really needs to be done and to drain Macedonian Diaspora of financial resources that should, and could, be better utilised to fight the TRAITORS within our ranks, especially in RM. In fact UMD is aligned with the Ramkovists and thus, IMO, it is also the enemy of the Macedonian people.[/QUOTE]

This is completely [U]unfounded [/U]and malicious.

AMitreski, What are your thoughts about Metodija's Speech in Melbourne??

Prolet wrote:
[QUOTE]I think a more important question is how do we gain name recognition from Australia.[/QUOTE]
:thumbup1::macedonia