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-   -   Macedonia & Greece: Name Issue (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1556)

Daskalot 06-24-2009 08:51 AM

[QUOTE=Rogi;18932]I'm not sure how many are aware of this, but in 2001 there were almost 1,000 Macedonian men from Australia (Melbourne) who gathered, with the intent of going to Macedonia to fight.

The Macedonian Govnerment was the one that didn't want them and rejected them, because it did not want an international incident with Australian citizens, and because it was calling up its soldiers, not all reserves, etc.

In other words, they didn't need or want the Macedonians from Australia (most of whom had only army training from their conscription over 20 years ago during Yugoslavia).[/QUOTE]

Interesting information, Rogi do you have a reference of this, a newspaper clipping or the like?

Jankovska 06-24-2009 09:10 AM

:whistling:[QUOTE=Rogi;18932]I'm not sure how many are aware of this, but in 2001 there were almost 1,000 Macedonian men from Australia (Melbourne) who gathered, with the intent of going to Macedonia to fight.

The Macedonian Govnerment was the one that didn't want them and rejected them, because it did not want an international incident with Australian citizens, and because it was calling up its soldiers, not all reserves, etc.

In other words, they didn't need or want the Macedonians from Australia (most of whom had only army training from their conscription over 20 years ago during Yugoslavia).[/QUOTE]

Why didn't they go than and maybe help differentley, help by being there? That is all well and nice Rogi but it is said in 2009 and I don't believe it very much. I do believe there were the odd few but this is sounds a bit to Macedonian, a be ja ke se tepase ama ne mi dadea. In 2001 I packed my little bags from London and went back home where my family are, thinking that this is my home and I will not sit and watch the BBC show me pictures of my country burning while I am enjoying the confort in the UK. I didn't fight but I would have.I didn't ask our goverment for permission. I took a small part in a Red Cross action but mostly I supported people around me.
Maybe if those 1000 people came back to Macedonia, even if they didn't fight the Macedonians would know that they were willing to. Saying it from OZ is a bit far streched

Giorikas 06-24-2009 09:24 AM

[QUOTE=Soldier of Macedon;18931]Moron, you are a racist, we both know this, you deny the right of another people to identify as they choose, so who's the little girl? I can live my life without denying your identity, you have to bitch about mine, you north-south compass Otto Hellenoidiot.

Your people didn't identify themselves as Greeks or Hellenes before their state was created by foreigners in the 19th century, Serbs are as 'Greek' as you, they too are from the 'Greek Church'. But that term means nothing to them in the real world. Just as the Macedonian term means nothing to modern Greeks in the real world. However, let's say, for arguments sake, that the Serbs chose to behave like idiots and deny the modern Greeks their name as it was a name used to refer to all Orthodox people.

Would you accept somebody else denying your people the right to identify as they choose? It doesn't matter what your reasons and responses are, nobody has the right to supress the identity of another people. What Greece is doing is racist, and what you are doing makes you a racist piece of scum, or a blind and stupid sheep.[/QUOTE]

Hmm. Greece says, you're all Greek if you hold the Greek nationality. We don't differentiate nazi style into 1st class ethnic Greeks and second class non ethnic Greek. Apart from that of course, it's a bit tricky identifying as ethnic pure, no matter what ethnicity you claim. Especially in the Balkans. How do you know how ethnically pure you really are ..

For the rest Greece's position is, feel whatever you want to, and by all means, organise yourselves through political parties if you want to change that. (and the odd 5,000 votes is not that impressive either)But we're not distinguishing according to 'ethnic' lines. Now how is that racist ? It's the opposite. I guess you prefer the Nazi way. And indeed I noticed the support from ... a nazi.

Now to cut a long story short. You're time after time asking, [I]demanding even[/I], that Greece changes that policy. Even making a link to the current negotiations as if you have a right to ask something back. But you should by now know that that will never happen. And let's be honest; who are you and the likes of Risto the Great exactly to make such demands. You're not even voting in Macedonia. You're Australian internet warriors identifying as Macedonians who achieved NOTHING. (or do you actually hold a Macedonian passport ?, in that case you are at least a Macedonian national)
But prove me wrong. What did you actually achieve in all this years ?

Giorikas 06-24-2009 09:31 AM

[QUOTE=Daskalot;18933]Why do we need another differentiation then what is already have Giorikas?

Are you also the "Republic" of Macedonia, because we all know that the word Macedonia is really not a problem for you, it has been included in most proposals thus far, so why do you have a problem with the prefix "Republic"?[/QUOTE]

I am sticking to the rules of this forum which require that I use the name Macedonia. It doesn't matter what I think of it.
Since I believe that eventually there will be a negotiated name that will include Macedonia, I am already preparing myself for that :2:. I hope I will be allowed to use the new name that will be acceptable by your and my country.

Rogi 06-24-2009 09:37 AM

Maybe you are right Jankovska.

Quite a few Macedonians did help though, as individuals and in their individual ways (contacting media, or sending money to their village leaders to buy whatever they need to defend themselves, etc etc).

But because of our disorganised state at the time as a community, the effect and contribution was very limited and went very unnoticed.

Jankovska 06-24-2009 09:47 AM

[QUOTE=Rogi;18940]Maybe you are right Jankovska.

Quite a few Macedonians did help though, as individuals and in their individual ways (contacting media, or sending money to their village leaders to buy whatever they need to defend themselves, etc etc).

But because of our disorganised state at the time as a community, the effect and contribution was very limited and went very unnoticed.[/QUOTE]

I know, it's a shame. We have a big Diaspora it just seems we find it hard to organise ourselves. Things are looking better, we have the UMD and few other organisations. We need a good strong one in Europe now. We'll get there

Rogi 06-24-2009 10:23 AM

UMD in France is coming along well and slowly building up a base.
Belgium, UK and Germany are starting up slowly but surely. Then there's Austria not far behind.

Russia and Ukraine are already up and active.

Giorikas 06-24-2009 11:37 AM

[QUOTE=Pelister;18898]They are traitors.

The Macedonian people had their say in September, 1991. Its done, finished.

Through the Act of negotiating, individuals in this government are undermining the Macedonian people's right to self determination, the democratic process, and our soveriegnty.[/QUOTE]

Why did not 1 of your governments ever pull out of those negotiations ? That would be the end of it. Do they know something more then the real experts like yourselves ?

Daskalot 06-24-2009 11:41 AM

[QUOTE=Giorikas;18938]I am sticking to the rules of this forum which require that I use the name Macedonia. It doesn't matter what I think of it.
Since I believe that eventually there will be a negotiated name that will include Macedonia, I am already preparing myself for that :2:. I hope I will be allowed to use the new name that will be acceptable by your and my country.[/QUOTE]

Surely it does matter what you think otherwise I would have never asked you :angel:

So what is the trouble with "Republic" because that seems to be the most vital part of the name issue here, your side always try to include something in between it and Macedonia, so surely the matter at hand is not the name Macedonia but rather the fact that we are a Republic, please shed some light on this from your point of view.

Daskalot 06-24-2009 11:45 AM

[QUOTE=Rogi;18942]UMD in France is coming along well and slowly building up a base.
Belgium, UK and Germany are starting up slowly but surely. Then there's Austria not far behind.

Russia and Ukraine are already up and active.[/QUOTE]

What about the Nordic countries like Sweden, Denmark and Norway??
Is the UMD represented over there?


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