Former and current Greek PMs planned attack on Macedonia with Milosevich

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  • Bill77
    Senior Member
    • Oct 2009
    • 4545

    Former and current Greek PMs planned attack on Macedonia with Milosevich

    Former and current Greek PMs planned attack on Macedonia with Milosevich

    If you carefully follow the Greek policy in the Balkans in the last 20 years, there is only one strategic goal on Athens' mind - Macedonia to disappear!

    Greece's ambitions during the first years of Macedonia's independence, and later during the 2001 externally orchestrated conflict were to occupy the Macedonian cities of Ohrid - Bitola, Prilep and Strumica.

    These plans for military aggression against Macedonia by the Greek Army (with government approval) were discussed during several meetings of Serbian and Greek politicians (Slobodan Milosevic, Constantine Mitsotakis and Antonis Samaras), of course, during certain phases of the discussions Romanian and Bulgarian politicians were invited as well.

    The entire mosaic of this plan is easily unfolded by several foreign intelligence reports, journalistic research, and in part from interviews and memoirs written by Mitsotakis, Milosevic, Samaras, Zhelyu Zhelev and Sali Berisha.

    For the realization of these strategic war plans it was not an accident that the Greeks staged two large military exercises, the first in 1992 named Alexandros and later in 1999 dubbed Philippos. During the first drill, Greek warplanes invaded Macedonian airspace numerous times at a depth of 37 kilometers, near the Demir Kapija gorge, exactly where official Athens saw their 'new' national frontier.

    Serbian-Greek border
    Takis Mihas, a Greek journalist and author of the "Evil Alliance" reveals Greece's role in the Yugoslav wars and their open support of the policies of Slobodan Milosevic. The purpose of Milosevic and Mitsotakis, a former Greek prime minister was to rearrange the borders in the Balkans as they see fit.

    As always, in the history of the Balkans, Macedonia has had a central place in each plan for a 'makeover'. To this day it remains an open question about the role of EU and NATO in these plans to draw some new inter-state borders.
    The role of Greece and Serbia in these plans was always very clear - Serbia and Greece to become neighbors.

    "There is a growing pile of evidence that lead to the conclusion that the influential political forces in Greece in the early 1990s looked at their Macedonian neighbors with much more than to change their name. The real goal of some instances was destabilization and disappearance of the young country," writes Greek journalist Takis Mihas.

    According to him, "Greek politicians insisted on the name change, although they were aware that it means giving up the most important symbol of the collective identity of the majority population, and as such, the requirement could not be met by Macedonian politicians."
    If behind these plans was hiding the plans for territorial conquest with "brotherly" Serbia, today Mitsotakis' strategic plan to destabilize Macedonia remained valid for all Greek governments after him.

    Everything is the same as in 1992
    In 1992 three meetings initiated by Mitsotakis took place in Athens. The main topic of each meeting was attack and division of Macedonia. During the first meeting, the president of Romania stunned by Mitsotakis' plan, rejected the proposal while representatives from SR Yugoslavia and Bulgaria's president abstained.

    The second meeting took place without Romania's president. Bulgaria once again abstained, while Milosevic asked for more time because of his engagement in Croatia and Bosnia.
    The third meeting was between Mitsotakis and Milosevic, only. However, the two failed to agree on a plan to attack Macedonia.

    Macedonia had sources, and was timely informed about Greece's initiatives and the meetings that took place in Athens. Official Skopje was also informed when the Greek Government in a secretive session approved an attack on Macedonia. Athens decided to do it alone.

    As a result, in October of 1992, a full scale military exercise dubbed Alexandros started two kilometers from the Macedonian border. The Macedonian Army for 10 days was at its highest combat readiness.

    Why Greece changed its mind and cancelled the agression is unclear. We can only speculate that it could have been prevented from the leader of the Greek Communist Party Aleka Papariga who in Solun announced "If Athens does not withdraw an important decision, she would tell the world". Another speculation is that warning came from Ankara to stay away from Macedonia.
    After Greece cancelled its military aggression on Macedoina, it quickly introduced an economic embargo by closing the border.

    This was an attempt by Greece to establish some sort of 'evidence' of Macedonia being unable to survive as a country economically. Greece's illegal move was followed by silence from Brussels and the EU.
    Plan for Athens military aggression on Macedonia was also confirmed by well known Greek military intelligence officer Grilakis, the man who walked into Crvenkovski, Frckovski, Gligorov's cabinets and gave them suitcases with cash and gifts for their willingness to change the name.

    Today, coincidentally or not, the alliance with Bulgaria and on occasion with Romania continues to repeat (meetings in Sofia and Athens), this time the topic being "blocking Macedonia's integration into the EU". This time, it is somewhat more sophisticated, unlike the plans for military aggression. EU's behavior is no different, it remained the same as in 1992.

    20 years later, the official Greek policy is guided by the same strategic goals defined by Mitsotakis and Samaras. The latter is the current Prime Minister of Greece. //Aleksandar Damovski/mkd
    http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=120873#post120873
  • sydney
    Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 390

    #2
    This episode still makes for fascinating reading. And this:

    As a result, in October of 1992, a full scale military exercise dubbed Alexandros started two kilometers from the Macedonian border. The Macedonian Army for 10 days was at its highest combat readiness.
    It makes for a great screenplay or book. Is it just me or is there a distinct lack of (auto)biographical material on Macedonian matters since the 80's?

    Comment

    • Phoenix
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2008
      • 4671

      #3
      ...I find it hard to believe anything that I read coming out of the fertile imagination of the good folk at MINA.

      I think they like stretching the 'truth'...

      To invade and then occupy, even a small country like Macedonia would be a massive undertaking for the greeks and/or the serbs.
      There are/were insignificant numbers of serbs in Macedonia and virtually fuck all greeks, so the 2 'invading' armies would have to commit huge resources to occuping territory, both human and material (something neither country has/had)
      The serbs at the time could barely hold the regions in the former YU, where they had large communities, let alone open other fronts in the war, and creating further international condemnation.

      A bit too much has been made of the serb/greek 'relationship'....a relationship that is stronger on rhetoric than anything of a real or meaningful nature...

      In 'A Concise History of Greece', by Richard Clogg (p.209) he writes the following:-

      "...Greek support for the Serbs was expressed at the level of rhetoric and government policies, whichever party was in power, offered little in the way of practical assistance to the Serbs".

      and from the same period (1990's) and around the same theme as the MINA article - "...Some observers went so far as to speak of the emergence of an 'Orthodox axis' in the Balkans that would bring together Greece, Serbia Bulgaria and Romania..."

      The MINA article is a rehash of shit that was floating around 20+ years ago.

      I think they need to stick to blowing sunshine up Gruevski's backside or wait to report on Pero Antic's next ventilator tattoo on his arse and leave the 'investigative journalism' to the suitably qualified.

      Comment

      • Gocka
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2012
        • 2306

        #4
        I also read this article this morning and after the first few lines it became obvious that there was a severe shortage of firsthand accounts and evidence. As Phoenix put it, how could Serbia undertake this when it could not even hold on to Bosnia which was half Serbian. As has been proved time and time again it is almost impossible to occupy a territory which has a different ethnicity of the occupier. Besides on what grounds could greece have invaded Macedonia? Surely the name dispute would not have been enough, there is no greek minority so they had 0 legitimate reasons to invade, even Serbia did not invade and let us secede peacefully because there were not really any Serbs in Macedonia and they could not conjure up a good enough reason for hostility. Mina is by all means 100% a pro Gruevski propaganda machine. Although they write articles that sometimes get the patriotic blood flowing ever so slightly. The have almost no credibility as a journalistic source. They are not always wrong but they write too many pro Gruevski stories to be taken seriously.

        Comment

        • momce
          Banned
          • Oct 2012
          • 426

          #5
          Modern greece cannot achieve its goals against Macedonia. All its ploys have been failures.

          Comment

          • Gocka
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2012
            • 2306

            #6
            Originally posted by momce View Post
            Modern greece cannot achieve its goals against Macedonia. All its ploys have been failures.
            I would have to respectfully disagree that greeces policies toward Macedonia have been failures. In fact I would say the opposite, the greeks have been very successful in greece, Macedonia, and internationally. In greece they have manipulated and brainwashed entire hordes of different ethnicity's that they are ethnic greeks (including Macedonians). They have gotten the large majority of their population on the anti Macedonian boat. Almost all of greece are believers of "greek" history.They were able to destabilize us economically and bribe our politicians. They made us change our name, change our flag, the have brought into question our identity which many people do question. They have caused people in ROM to doubt themselves and doubt their own legitimacy. Internationally they have decent support despite their problems domestically. Most of the world is much more pro greece rather than pro Macedonian. History in most institutions and countries favors the greek interpretation of history. Biggest of all they have made us set a precedent that our name and idea is on the table to be debated, that is the single biggest victory that they can have that will haunt us for centuries to come. 200 years from now someone will pick up a book and sight (rightfully so) that the Macedonians were willing to negotiate and that must mean that they themselves did not whole heartedly believe their own assertions. Believe me my friend they have won a good portion of this war already, and if we shoot ourselves in the foot a few more times like we've done already then you can say goodbye to our nation and our people because we will wipe ourselves out. I hate them with passion but they are winning and I think people need to step back and realize that. All this anti greel chest beating may be fun and make us feel good but they are playing out their moves and we are standing still.

            Comment

            • The LION will ROAR
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2009
              • 3231

              #7
              There's another thread on it..

              NATO knows Greek plan to attack Macedonia

              NATO knows Greek plan to attack Macedonia http://novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=8812846196&id=9&prilog=0&setIzdanie=22650#.UCI7pJUaOIo.facebook Google Translations - Greece prepares plans to invade Macedonia and presents them in NATO, pulling the territorial claims that we supposedly have to
              The Macedonians originates it, the Bulgarians imitate it and the Greeks exploit it!

              Comment

              • Phoenix
                Senior Member
                • Dec 2008
                • 4671

                #8
                Originally posted by Gocka View Post
                I would have to respectfully disagree that greeces policies toward Macedonia have been failures. In fact I would say the opposite, the greeks have been very successful in greece, Macedonia, and internationally. In greece they have manipulated and brainwashed entire hordes of different ethnicity's that they are ethnic greeks (including Macedonians). They have gotten the large majority of their population on the anti Macedonian boat. Almost all of greece are believers of "greek" history.They were able to destabilize us economically and bribe our politicians. They made us change our name, change our flag, the have brought into question our identity which many people do question. They have caused people in ROM to doubt themselves and doubt their own legitimacy. Internationally they have decent support despite their problems domestically. Most of the world is much more pro greece rather than pro Macedonian. History in most institutions and countries favors the greek interpretation of history. Biggest of all they have made us set a precedent that our name and idea is on the table to be debated, that is the single biggest victory that they can have that will haunt us for centuries to come. 200 years from now someone will pick up a book and sight (rightfully so) that the Macedonians were willing to negotiate and that must mean that they themselves did not whole heartedly believe their own assertions. Believe me my friend they have won a good portion of this war already, and if we shoot ourselves in the foot a few more times like we've done already then you can say goodbye to our nation and our people because we will wipe ourselves out. I hate them with passion but they are winning and I think people need to step back and realize that. All this anti greel chest beating may be fun and make us feel good but they are playing out their moves and we are standing still.
                ...spot on.

                Comment

                • Momce Makedonce
                  Member
                  • Jul 2012
                  • 562

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Gocka View Post
                  I would have to respectfully disagree that greeces policies toward Macedonia have been failures. In fact I would say the opposite, the greeks have been very successful in greece, Macedonia, and internationally. In greece they have manipulated and brainwashed entire hordes of different ethnicity's that they are ethnic greeks (including Macedonians). They have gotten the large majority of their population on the anti Macedonian boat. Almost all of greece are believers of "greek" history.They were able to destabilize us economically and bribe our politicians. They made us change our name, change our flag, the have brought into question our identity which many people do question. They have caused people in ROM to doubt themselves and doubt their own legitimacy. Internationally they have decent support despite their problems domestically. Most of the world is much more pro greece rather than pro Macedonian. History in most institutions and countries favors the greek interpretation of history. Biggest of all they have made us set a precedent that our name and idea is on the table to be debated, that is the single biggest victory that they can have that will haunt us for centuries to come. 200 years from now someone will pick up a book and sight (rightfully so) that the Macedonians were willing to negotiate and that must mean that they themselves did not whole heartedly believe their own assertions. Believe me my friend they have won a good portion of this war already, and if we shoot ourselves in the foot a few more times like we've done already then you can say goodbye to our nation and our people because we will wipe ourselves out. I hate them with passion but they are winning and I think people need to step back and realize that. All this anti greel chest beating may be fun and make us feel good but they are playing out their moves and we are standing still.
                  That is very sad but true...spot on like Phoenix said
                  "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task." Goce Delcev

                  Comment

                  • momce
                    Banned
                    • Oct 2012
                    • 426

                    #10
                    Just be patient all of greece ploys will turn out to much ado about nothing in the end. Sit tight make your friends and allies, agitate, arm etc. Greeceanoid isnt in the limelight anymore.

                    Comment

                    • momce
                      Banned
                      • Oct 2012
                      • 426

                      #11
                      I doubt there is any military threat from greeceanoid. Its mostly a propaganda and pressure campaign. And the embargo was lifted because the greekanoids themselves were losing money.

                      Comment

                      • TrueMacedonian
                        Banned
                        • Jan 2009
                        • 3823

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
                        ...I find it hard to believe anything that I read coming out of the fertile imagination of the good folk at MINA.

                        I think they like stretching the 'truth'...

                        To invade and then occupy, even a small country like Macedonia would be a massive undertaking for the greeks and/or the serbs.
                        There are/were insignificant numbers of serbs in Macedonia and virtually fuck all greeks, so the 2 'invading' armies would have to commit huge resources to occuping territory, both human and material (something neither country has/had)
                        The serbs at the time could barely hold the regions in the former YU, where they had large communities, let alone open other fronts in the war, and creating further international condemnation.

                        A bit too much has been made of the serb/greek 'relationship'....a relationship that is stronger on rhetoric than anything of a real or meaningful nature...
                        In 'A Concise History of Greece', by Richard Clogg (p.209) he writes the following:-

                        "...Greek support for the Serbs was expressed at the level of rhetoric and government policies, whichever party was in power, offered little in the way of practical assistance to the Serbs".

                        and from the same period (1990's) and around the same theme as the MINA article - "...Some observers went so far as to speak of the emergence of an 'Orthodox axis' in the Balkans that would bring together Greece, Serbia Bulgaria and Romania..."

                        The MINA article is a rehash of shit that was floating around 20+ years ago.

                        I think they need to stick to blowing sunshine up Gruevski's backside or wait to report on Pero Antic's next ventilator tattoo on his arse and leave the 'investigative journalism' to the suitably qualified.
                        I think you should read Takis Michas book "Unholy Alliance". His source is Alexandros Tarkas who was a senior policy advisor to Samaras. The idea was indeed floating around. There is no doubt about it. Also the entire book, loaded with sources from media, politicians, and experts, displays the sort of relationship modern Greece had with Serbia. And this was the paradox. Here is a Nato member, modern Greece, and they showed complete support of Serbia. Greeks even took part in the war and they proudly waved a blue false "vergina" flag alongside that of Serbia's.

                        Comment

                        • momce
                          Banned
                          • Oct 2012
                          • 426

                          #13
                          These "ideas that were floating around" probably were just usual greece hot air, like a case of bad wind. Nothing happened. I wouldnt be too concerned about greece as a security threat to anyone they are mostly incompetent.
                          Last edited by momce; 02-14-2013, 10:37 PM.

                          Comment

                          • Risto the Great
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 15661

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
                            ...spot on.
                            " spot" makes it sound small.
                            But, yes.
                            Risto the Great
                            MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                            "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                            Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                            Comment

                            • Risto the Great
                              Senior Member
                              • Sep 2008
                              • 15661

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Gocka View Post
                              I would have to respectfully disagree that greeces policies toward Macedonia have been failures. In fact I would say the opposite, the greeks have been very successful in greece, Macedonia, and internationally. In greece they have manipulated and brainwashed entire hordes of different ethnicity's that they are ethnic greeks (including Macedonians). They have gotten the large majority of their population on the anti Macedonian boat. Almost all of greece are believers of "greek" history.They were able to destabilize us economically and bribe our politicians. They made us change our name, change our flag, the have brought into question our identity which many people do question. They have caused people in ROM to doubt themselves and doubt their own legitimacy. Internationally they have decent support despite their problems domestically. Most of the world is much more pro greece rather than pro Macedonian. History in most institutions and countries favors the greek interpretation of history. Biggest of all they have made us set a precedent that our name and idea is on the table to be debated, that is the single biggest victory that they can have that will haunt us for centuries to come. 200 years from now someone will pick up a book and sight (rightfully so) that the Macedonians were willing to negotiate and that must mean that they themselves did not whole heartedly believe their own assertions. Believe me my friend they have won a good portion of this war already, and if we shoot ourselves in the foot a few more times like we've done already then you can say goodbye to our nation and our people because we will wipe ourselves out. I hate them with passion but they are winning and I think people need to step back and realize that. All this anti greel chest beating may be fun and make us feel good but they are playing out their moves and we are standing still.
                              I was overseas when I briefly referred to your post Gocka.

                              Your sentiments have long been conveyed here on this forum. There is a significant percentage of the Macedonian Diaspora that would prefer to condemn people who share your opinion as being nothing more than crazy nationalists.

                              Only the most naive of Macedonians believe Macedonia has a master plan that is working in its favour.

                              The reality is quite the reverse and the proof (you have listed above) is obvious.
                              Risto the Great
                              MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                              "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                              Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                              Comment

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