Razer and Stefan - Bulgar morons

[Razer]

@ Risto the Great

I agree Macedonians are different than Bulgarians and you need to have your own independent country. But I can't agree with most of your historical arguments, which simply don't stand on solid ground. Sorry, it's not me saying it - it's the established historical academia.

[Razer]

And it's even sad for me because those claims are not helping you with your European integration, and in the long term will only hurt your country...You'll see...

[Big Bad Sven]

And it's even sad for me because those claims are not helping you with your European integration, and in the long term will only hurt your country...You'll see...

So what are the macedonians supposed to do?

Bow down to grk and bulgar pressure and admit that Macedonias ancient history is "greek" and macedonia's modern/medieval history is "bulgarian", and basically say they have no history prior 1945, all in the superficial effort to join the broke and anti-macedonian EU? Is this real life brah?

What does history have to do with integration with the EU anyway? I can understand minority issues (which bulgaria clearly abuses btw) being a issue for a country joining, but history is a non-issue and shouldn't even be considered. Let the historians and people on the internet fight over who alexander the great was, not hold poor macedonia ransom with unreasonable demands because of history.

Its ironic that slavic bulgaria and make belief greece are allowed into the EU even though their human rights record is extremely poor, while macedonia is not allowed in over some dumb historical dispute.

I would imagine if the foot was on the other foot and macedonia denied the bulgarian slavs entry into the EU because the bulgarian slavs claimed Tsar Samuel, you would be on here crying blue murder.

[Onur]

I'm not sure I understand your question. Can you pls paraphrase it? I'll answer you as much as I can, I promise

I cant paraphrase better than i did above but i got my answer anyway and that was something i have expected from you, i mean, no response at all.

I think you're overestimating some claims. The view that Buglars are of Iranian origin has developed over the past 20 years and it's not just a wishful dreaming.

I don't care what they teach you there. Whoever you were or whatever language you spoke before, our point here is that you have been forcefully assimilated with your current language and both your state and people [at least some of them] has been culturally transformed. The ironic thing is, you guys adopted your new language and script from Ohrid&Salonika as your own.

Before repeating your arguments again, can you read what Cyril&Methodius said about Bulgars of 9th century in this message;

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4276&p=69743

Is this something can be said if they would be Bulgars themselves?

[Razer]

I personally think both Macedonians and Bulgarians should be proud of the history they share. You have a lot more ammunition against the Greeks, claiming the right of Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonian kingdom, since some historians indeed don't classify them as Greek. I also don't think they were Greek. The Greeks are the biggest copycats of history - they even say the Thracian were Greek. Nonsense...

But claiming medieval Bulgarian history is your biggest mistake. Look at the Armenians - they also had a role in medieval Bulgaria, but do they claim it? No. Instead, Bulgaria and Armenia enjoy a great relationship and Armenians are some of the proudest people living in Bulgarian.

Look at the US - they history only goes back 200 years or so, but they are the proudest people on the planet. You have a history going back over 2000 years, but it's just presented in a wrong way, that's it.

[Razer]

I don't care what they teach you there. Whoever you were or whatever language you spoke before, our point here is that you have been forcefully assimilated with your current language

Nonsense. I recommend you spend at least 10-15 min studying Boris I. Uneducated people like you are making the problem worse. I mean, go learn some facts first bro, this is pure comedy coming from your side...

[Razer]

I'll look at the link you posted and get back to you later...

[Onur]

And it's even sad for me because those claims are not helping you with your European integration, and in the long term will only hurt your country...You'll see...

What is European integration? You were under commie regime as Russian vassals `till 1990s and your state trying to be a democratic one just recently.

What you gained from your so-called european integration? Pretty much the most important event that i remember about Bulgaria`s so-called "european integration" was Sarkozy`s deportation of gypsies to your country. I also know that Dutch and French doesn't want you in schengen zone. Is this the european integration you are talking about?

[Razer]

@ Onur

It's obvious you hate everything Bulgarian, so from now on I'll ignore you (unless you change your attitude).

[Big Bad Sven]

I personally think both Macedonians and Bulgarians should be proud of the history they share. You have a lot more ammunition against the Greeks, claiming the right of Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonian kingdom, since some historians indeed don't classify them as Greek. I also don't think they were Greek. The Greeks are the biggest copycats of history - they even say the Thracian were Greek. Nonsense...

But claiming medieval Bulgarian history is your biggest mistake. Look at the Armenians - they also had a role in medieval Bulgaria, but do they claim it? No. Instead, Bulgaria and Armenia enjoy a great relationship and Armenians are some of the proudest people living in Bulgarian.

Look at the US - they history only goes back 200 years or so, but they are the proudest people on the planet. You have a history going back over 2000 years, but it's just presented in a wrong way, that's it.

But important people like Tsar Samuel, Sv Naum, Cyril and Methodius, Goce Delcev and Sandanski were macedonian, not bulgarian slavs.

Macedonian history goes further back then a few hundred years brah. We had civilized macedonians like Cyril and Methodius educating the bulgarian slavs who were nothing more then uneducated conquered peons to the turkic khan bulgars.

The only connection i see with the bulgars is that macedonians were part of their sphere of influence for a very long time, especially during the ottoman period. You are in the same group as the new age greeks, modern day conquerors and invaders of macedonia, and also thieves of macedonian history and culture.

[Risto the Great]

@ Risto the Great

I agree Macedonians are different than Bulgarians and you need to have your own independent country. But I can't agree with most of your historical arguments, which simply don't stand on solid ground. Sorry, it's not me saying it - it's the established historical academia.

What can't you agree with? That Bulgars learned how to speak a language like Macedonian as a result of influences in their newly migrated region?

Who did the Bulgars learn their new language from? You might want to ask the "academia".

[Risto the Great]

Razer, is it offensive to be called Bulgarian Slavs? Because I often see it used in a similar fashion in relation to Macedonians in your news journals. I find it offensive.

[Risto the Great]

And it's even sad for me because those claims are not helping you with your European integration, and in the long term will only hurt your country...You'll see...

What should historical claims have to do with European integration? I mean Greece is doing this with Macedonia already ... but Greece is a little historically challenged.

While we're at it, what is actually so good about Bulgaria's EU integration? I notice its foreign debt has skyrocketed and people don't look any richer. I also note Greeks are getting pay-cuts every week. Is it really that good? I'm not buying it.

[Razer]

@ Risto the Great

Actually, Bulgaria has managed to reduce it's foreign debt about 10 times since the fall of Communism and today it's the second lowest in EU. I think the biggest benefit of joining the EU is in the tourism sector, which grows every year. More and more people from the West are visiting the country, plus the EU helps with the founding of different infrastructure and reconstruction projects. So there are positive factors. Are salaries still low in Bulgaria? Yes. Are pensions low? Yes. Is living in Bulgaria all perfect? Of course not. But I think the country is moving forward, and this is why I choose to stay here and be part of it.

[Razer]

Razer, is it offensive to be called Bulgarian Slavs? Because I often see it used in a similar fashion in relation to Macedonians in your news journals. I find it offensive.

Slavs and Bulgars share so much history, even before the official establishment of Danube Bulgaria. It's not offensive to link the two names, not at all.