Brian's Corner

[Phoenix]

LOL. Good idea, unless it's a critical situation anything other than vitamins is bad for you.

Ozimak, there's a strong school of thought that questions the notion that vitamin pills are useful to most people...maybe you haven't taken enough 'crveni' to realise...?

[Phoenix]

Your claim that your statement "quantity V quality" relates to the contents of the thread ie the posts is nonsensical as the subject was the 'view count' and it's inferred quality of the contents. Your not arguing the point but going off on a tangent.

You seem to have a problem with sticking to the flow and point of a conversation - ie you're an idiot, which was my first contention. Case proven - again!

Look, apparently there's some confusion here...you said, she said...bla, bla, bla...

Let there be no doubt, I think you're a clown.

[Brian]

I was refering to the quantity of your posts V their quality.

You above statement is in response to
Phoenix Post431...

Ozimak, you refered to the view count of 'Brian's Corner'...never confuse quantity V quality.

Brian Post344...

You're a proven liar and now a proven idiot - there CAN BE a quantity of 'Views' but there CANNOT BE a quality of views you idiot - unless of course you think the MTO members and non-member readers are not quality enough.LOL. You're and idiot.

The 'view count' is the subject of the sentence. Since the view count is obviously a reference to 'popularity' of the thread and hence it's inferred quality, as people like to read quality news pieces and stay away from rubbish, your point "quantity V quality" must be taken to also relate to the subject ie the 'view count' as it infers quality through quantity hence my post that "there can be a quantity of views but there cannot be a quality of views".

Your claim that your statement "quantity V quality" relates to the contents of the thread ie the posts is nonsensical as the subject was the 'view count' and it's inferred quality of the contents. Your not arguing the point but going off on a tangent.

You seem to have a problem with sticking to the flow and point of a conversation - ie you're an idiot, which was my first contention. Case proven - again!

[EgejskaMakedonia]

See, if you had a brain you wouldn't keep repeating the 'ancient alien' thing at me when it was YOU who FIRST talked about it yet you try to make it sound like it's my topic despite my repeatedly telling you keep YOUR stupidity to yourself and stop lying by accusing me of it.

Who with a brain keeps repeating something when it has been shown they started it and they're the only side talking about it and their false accusations against others have been exposed - a person with a brain would realise their stupid trick didn't work and now they are telling the world how stupid they are.

I think most people would view such actions as that of a person without a brain hence by your deeds my statement you don't have a brain.

You would know a thing or two about 'repeating something,' especially with your unhealthy 'word' obsession you have developed. Keep repeating the words 'dweeb' and 'pathetic,' it makes you look very intelligent.

I never said you spoke of Aliens. Yet, your fascination with numerous conspiracy theories is essentially what prompted me to use the 'Ancient Aliens' videos. You really are like a robot...do I have to spell out everything EXACTLY how it is for you to understand?..or are you capable of comprehending the meaning behind a post on your own?
You don't have to say anything about aliens for me to use Giorgio as a joke. It's merely drawing comparisons between your borderless mind and his uncanny theories.

You can't know if people just click on the thread and don't read it or do read it. It would be stupid of people to waste their time clicking on the thread with the intent of NOT reading it thus it is more likely that they are reading it. If you had a brain you would realise such simple logic and not make the above statement.

Equally, it is stupid to assume that because you have 9500 views, your thread somehow 'reigns supreme.' Boasting about the number of views 'Brian's corner' enjoys is a PATHETIC argument. As mentioned earlier, quantity by no means satisfies quality.

At aprox 2000 views per month if half those views were mine ie 1000 views per month means 33 views per day. Does it sound logical I would login 33 times a day just to click on my thread? Do you think I might have other things to do in a day?

Again, you take everything so literally. Obviously half of those views are not yours (I hope), but that's not to say that the current figure doesn't owe a special thanks to its' biggest and most loyal fan, Brian. It is your thread, so that's understandable, but why are you even using this reason as some kind of quality assurance measure?

If you took your and Phoenix's replies out of this thread virtually all the stupid posts would be gone.

I beg to differ.

My reference to NWO scum was at Phoenix, you may have just read it that way. Besides you don't have a brain and are too stupid to be NWO scum.

So you determine my intelligence off a few posts in 'Brian's corner,' you're a genius!
If I called you stupid, then I will retract that statement. I think you're an idiot, which is slightly different, but you do have some degree of intelligence (albeit invested in the wrong area).

There are scientific, economic and political reasons to be concerned at this time which happens to be 2012, but not because of the '2012' hype so there is no scaremongering in my posts. Not even the NWO references are scaremongering because they too are real.

It might be real, but your attitude towards this issue is very over the top, therefore IT IS scaremongering. You weren't one of those y2k nuts were you?

If you think I have said something idiotic then you calling me an idiot makes sense. Likewise when you say something that is pathetic it also makes sense for me to call it and you pathetic because it is pathetic.

No, a comparison cannot be drawn here. You were overconfident in labeling my family and I as pathetic based on a real life scenario. Despite having no idea of the implication involved with our name, you jumped the gun and immediately began throwing accusations around. That is an attack on a personal level. If you say something idiotic on the forum, then that is a product of your own thoughts, and yes, it would make sense to call you an idiot. But to call someone pathetic in a sensitive and complicated matter, without having ANY clue whatsoever about any issues that may arise in their particular circumstances, then really, it is you who is the pathetic one.

What does not make sense is to constantly throw accusations of things which YOU MADE UP YOURSELF re aliens ect. You see, just throwing negative words around is when there is NO REASON for those words and if you had a brain you would realise this is what the sentence means IRRESPECTIVE if you felt provoked or not. You were pathetic and hence I called you that and now that you resort to made up accusations to throw at me makes you even more pathetic and that you keep repeating those made up accusations even when they have been proven to be false makes you even more pathetic then that. By continuing with your pathetic weak lies repeatedly after they have been exposed makes you inept at understanding conversations and hence a pathetic dweeb.

I have answered this in the beginning of my post. The aliens example runs parallel to your attitude and image on this forum. You may not have said a thing about aliens, but everything about your writing style, opinions and articles draws comparisons with the attitude of those found on conspiracy TV shows...whether it be about area 51, 9/11 or any other clouded issue. I think you need to learn what a lie is Brian. Not once, have I said that you stated this and that about aliens...all I've done is post the clips/quotes and link them to you.

If you find my post boring then don't click on "Brian's Corner" and don't read them. Are you too stupid to realise this. And you wonder why I call you pathetic.

I find your responses very entertaining, but your general articles boring. I'm going to make an effort though and read your general posts, because I actually want to find something we can agree upon. I'm not flaming you for the sake of it, there are reasons. You however, seem to be stuck on some pre-assumption that anything I say you must disagree with and view as 'pathetic.'

I am very much able to take a joke, even when it is at my expense, I am Australian after all, but I am social adept to realise when a joke is not a joke but slander and not to put-up with such rubbish and when a pathetic dweeb is trying to slander me and then hide behind that pathetic excuse 'it was just a joke, can't you take a joke'.

Hmm, this sounds familiar. Do you remember when you 'joked' about people who suffer from epilepsy? I noticed you skipped that part in my last post. That is an instance where 'it was just a joke' excuse would not be acceptable. Yet, comparing jokes directed toward you about aliens and Giorgio Tsoukalos with a comment about somebody's mental well-being is a joke in itself. Stop trying to crawl into your corner and play the victim, when you have stooped far lower than 'slander' or any other rubbish you think is currently being projected at you.

If you are going to be a liar, provocateur, and character assassin at least be a bloody good one and not the piss-weak pathetic goes so far you pathetic dweeb and man enough to at least realise your stupidity if not own up to it.

Stop throwing your toys out of the crib Brian. You sound like you're desperately trying to explain the situation within one sentence, without saving a breath to re-read your childish dribble.

When you lie like a pathetic Greek then that's what I will call you.

So if I'm Greek for whatever reason you can muster, are you prepared to accuse everyone in my family, from my village/town/city, and the entire Aegean Macedonia population as being Greek. I can't just be the odd one out in my family Brian, unless I was adopted...and somehow I don't think I am. Make sure you don't lose your collar tag Brian, because it's quite harsh telling someone who they are, without knowing yourself first.

So you enjoy wasting your time watching things you find boring and stupid repeatedly - if that's not stupidity in itself, what is?

When did I say it was boring? I might think it's ridiculous and outlandish, but that doesn't mean it's not entertaining. A bit like you.

If you are incapable of distinguishing our (OziMak and mine) writing styles then that's your weakness.

The only two things I can think of that we have in common beyond the obvious, both being male Macedonian in Australia, is that he had some, and I stress the word some, correct views on the NWO and a very low tolerance for stupidity like I do which with you and Phoenix this site abounds in. Enough to make Vostarec leave on his own accord.

They seem very similar, and it would also seem reasonable that you would alter your style slightly to avoid raising suspicions. But I'm not going to get into conspiracy theories here. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and take your word for it. But I hope to god you are telling the truth, because after all this 'lie' bullshit you have preached, I would hate to think how much of a hypocrite you would be. I can't say I believe you, nor trust you, but I have to. Only a pathetic little dweeb would accuse someone of being a Greek for lying, and then pull off a lie such as this. May your conscience eat you alive if you are not telling the truth.

I don't think many members will agree (judging by the poll) but I've voted 'No.'

[Brian]

Oh wow, after a quick search through a few of the more recent posts from Ozimak, I'm inclined to believe you are the same character Brian.

A side of a wall has a straight line and the side of your block-head also has a straight line and even though your head knows about as much or less then the wall I would not jump to the conclusion that you and the wall are necessarily the same thing based on one or two small characteristics.

I know I'm probably a few months behind the ball, but here's one post that is pretty much a carbon copy of your last response.





Here you questioned Risto whether he is Greek, just as you have with myself, based on supposed 'lies.'

Are Irish jokes not well known by millions around the world? So if two people know that Irish jokes try to make out the Irish are stupid then does this mean they are the same person?LOL.LOL.LOL.

Is it not a common belief by Macedonian that Greeks lie - hell, now even the whole world knows this. So do you think the expression 'you lie like a Greek' may have been heard and said by more then just one Macedonian? Or is this your 'absolute proof' I am OziMak?LOL.LOL.LOL.

Not to mention, the word pathetic seems to be a favourite of Ozimak's as well. Maybe you 'two' have more in common than I first expected. Do you use the later of Ozimak's posts as inspiration for your 'own' dribble?

If something is pathetic (like you) it is reasonable for ANYONE to call it pathetic. Just because someone else has used the word pathetic on this site before me should I now feel obliged not use that word?LOL.LOL.LOL.

Have not other people (besides OziMak and I) used the word pathetic before on this site before? I can't be bothered wasting my time doing searches on such a common word but feel confident that others have. Are they also OziMak for using the common word pathetic to describe something pathetic. You and Phoenix use the word aliens a lot, are you and Phoenix the same person?LOL.LOL.LOL.

Can you see the stupidity in your statements?LOL.LOL.LOL.

In all honesty I actually liked Ozimak as a poster during his time at Maknews and early existence at the MTO.

I have never been associated with Maknews so I don't know if OziMak was there if by which you mean to compare some quote or writting style or something.

But if that person has now transformed into 'Brian,' all I can say is...where did we go wrong? Or maybe I was just too young at the time to see through his colourful words.

From the poor level of logic you display I think you were wrong from the day you were born.

[Brian]

My 5 year plan is to kick my (whatever colour) pill habit.

LOL. Good idea, unless it's a critical situation anything other than vitamins is bad for you.

[Brian]

Last time I checked I did have a brain...unless the ancient aliens have abducted it since.

See, if you had a brain you wouldn't keep repeating the 'ancient alien' thing at me when it was YOU who FIRST talked about it yet you try to make it sound like it's my topic despite my repeatedly telling you keep YOUR stupidity to yourself and stop lying by accusing me of it.

Who with a brain keeps repeating something when it has been shown they started it and they're the only side talking about it and their false accusations against others have been exposed - a person with a brain would realise their stupid trick didn't work and now they are telling the world how stupid they are.

I think most people would view such actions as that of a person without a brain hence by your deeds my statement you don't have a brain.

People might click on your thread Brian, but not necessarily read much of it.

You can't know if people just click on the thread and don't read it or do read it. It would be stupid of people to waste their time clicking on the thread with the intent of NOT reading it thus it is more likely that they are reading it. If you had a brain you would realise such simple logic and not make the above statement.


Besides, you probably constitue at least half of those views.

At aprox 2000 views per month if half those views were mine ie 1000 views per month means 33 views per day. Does it sound logical I would login 33 times a day just to click on my thread? Do you think I might have other things to do in a day?


An additional 1500 views than initially expected...must be aliens.

Again with YOUR alien stupidity.

Not to mention, at least half the people that comment in this thread thoroughly enjoy your comedic replies, nothing more..nothing less.

If you took your and Phoenix's replies out of this thread virtually all the stupid posts would be gone.


Haha, 'NWO scum?' Are you insane or just an idiot? I never said I was totally unaware of the NWO plot.

My reference to NWO scum was at Phoenix, you may have just read it that way. Besides you don't have a brain and are too stupid to be NWO scum.

I think you just exaggerate it beyond belief, to the point where you're beginning to sound like those '2012-end of the world' kooks. I do believe that Wall Street heavily influences the policy of the US Government and that politicians are often used simply as the 'public faces,' but spare me your scaremongering.

There are scientific, economic and political reasons to be concerned at this time which happens to be 2012, but not because of the '2012' hype so there is no scaremongering in my posts. Not even the NWO references are scaremongering because they too are real.

Throwing negative words at you? I would never do such a thing unless I was attacked or provoked first. Are you forgetting of our first encounters where you had no trouble labelling me as a 'pathetic' individual a mere 10 or so times? I'm beyond the point of showing respect or manners to a dweeb such as yourself.

If you think I have said something idiotic then you calling me an idiot makes sense. Likewise when you say something that is pathetic it also makes sense for me to call it and you pathetic because it is pathetic.

What does not make sense is to constantly throw accusations of things which YOU MADE UP YOURSELF re aliens ect. You see, just throwing negative words around is when there is NO REASON for those words and if you had a brain you would realise this is what the sentence means IRRESPECTIVE if you felt provoked or not. You were pathetic and hence I called you that and now that you resort to made up accusations to throw at me makes you even more pathetic and that you keep repeating those made up accusations even when they have been proven to be false makes you even more pathetic then that. By continuing with your pathetic weak lies repeatedly after they have been exposed makes you inept at understanding conversations and hence a pathetic dweeb.



I find your general posts somewhat boring, but your specific replies to myself never cease to amaze me.

If you find my post boring then don't click on "Brian's Corner" and don't read them. Are you too stupid to realise this. And you wonder why I call you pathetic.


You claim that I am socially inept, yet you struggle to take a joke. The fact that you are so defensive over this 'aliens' business is quite worrying, really.

I am very much able to take a joke, even when it is at my expense, I am Australian after all, but I am social adept to realise when a joke is not a joke but slander and not to put-up with such rubbish and when a pathetic dweeb is trying to slander me and then hide behind that pathetic excuse 'it was just a joke, can't you take a joke'.

If you are going to be a liar, provocateur, and character assassin at least be a bloody good one and not the piss-weak pathetic goes so far you pathetic dweeb and man enough to at least realise your stupidity if not own up to it.

What a low blow Brian, calling me a Greek. I'm not going to give you the response you crave here.

When you lie like a pathetic Greek then that's what I will call you.

You have already proved how insensitive and insulting you are when you made your infamous epileptic 'joke.'

Because, it amuses me how ridiculous some people can be in this world. I also enjoy watching comedy shows.

So you enjoy wasting your time watching things you find boring and stupid repeatedly - if that's not stupidity in itself, what is?

You have already admitted that you are socially and emotionally empty in the 'alternative name' thread, so it's rich coming from a simpleton like you.

I think you have repeatedly proven what a simpleton you are.

Next time I'll walk you to the park and throw you a frisbee. You're free to take photos of it and report Brian's UFO discovery.

Again with the UFO rubbish. Are you so incapable of coming up with a better lie - absolutely pathetic.

You know, if you are indeed OziMak (and I honestly have no idea, because I didn't see enough of his posts) then I was one of the few people who were defending you in regards to the name OziMak being changed to FYROM, as well as the avatar, which was also altered. It's actually the moment when I became active in this forum.

I'll actually look through a few of OziMak's posts today and form an opinion on who you really are.

If you are incapable of distinguishing our (OziMak and mine) writing styles then that's your weakness.

The only two things I can think of that we have in common beyond the obvious, both being male Macedonian in Australia, is that he had some, and I stress the word some, correct views on the NWO and a very low tolerance for stupidity like I do which with you and Phoenix this site abounds in. Enough to make Vostarec leave on his own accord.

Do you think my responses will increase or decrease the views to this thread.LOL.LOL.LOL.

Just stay away - I don't have time to waste with dweeby, incompetent, socially inept, piss-weak wanna-be character assassins like you.

[EgejskaMakedonia]

Oh wow, after a quick search through a few of the more recent posts from Ozimak, I'm inclined to believe you are the same character Brian.

I know I'm probably a few months behind the ball, but here's one post that is pretty much a carbon copy of your last response.

Your NOT TOTALLY stupid RtG, and you know VERY well the way you wrote it could VERY EASILY lead the reader to think they are my statements! Your Not going to play dumb now like you didn't know, are you???

More of your/this site typical lies and smear-campaign to vilify ANYONE who does Not Absolutely agree with you.

Your attempts at character assassination in a SLY underhanded manor are pathetic and typify you and the demi-gods.

When I want to say something I come out and say it and NOT with PATHETIC SNEAKY TRICKERY.

We KNOW Greeks lie WITHOUT ANY shame.
We NOW know RtG lies in sneaky ways WITHOUT shame.
mmm....You wouldn't happen to have any Greek in you, would you???

Why don't you ever argue the points/answer the questions? instead always trying to shift the focus or hurl abuse - maybe because you have no answers???

Here you questioned Risto whether he is Greek, just as you have with myself, based on supposed 'lies.' Not to mention, the word pathetic seems to be a favourite of Ozimak's as well. Maybe you 'two' have more in common than I first expected. Do you use the later of Ozimak's posts as inspiration for your 'own' dribble?

In all honesty I actually liked Ozimak as a poster during his time at Maknews and early existence at the MTO. But if that person has now transformed into 'Brian,' all I can say is...where did we go wrong? Or maybe I was just too young at the time to see through his colourful words.

[EgejskaMakedonia]

Giorgio Tsoukalos has got a killer hairdo...I reckon he must have been standing under a UFO as it passed overhead and some weird static force reacted with his hair...there's no other viable explanation...unless it was a bad reaction to the 'red pills'...

Loll who knows what 'pills' this stooge has been on.

He does make some good points though...

Giorgio Tsoukalos on Ancient Assonauts - YouTube

Giorgio A. Tsoukalos explains Ancient Aliens - YouTube

[Risto the Great]

LOL. So great business leader has no 5, 10 and 20 year economic plan? Only ribbing you RtG.

My 5 year plan is to kick my (whatever colour) pill habit.

[EgejskaMakedonia]

Hey idiot, "Brian's Corner" is a place for people with brains - it might be better if you STAYED AWAY, your idiot comments are just a distraction and have no value here.

Last time I checked I did have a brain...unless the ancient aliens have abducted it since.

Firstly if you had any brains you might look to the right on the same line before you click on "Brian's Corner" and notice that the 'Views' count is just under 9 1/2 thousand as at 24 Feb 2012 - not such a "lonely" corner after all.

People might click on your thread Brian, but not necessarily read much of it. Besides, you probably constitue at least half of those views.

Not that I want to toot my own horn, but since your making an issue of it, I joined the MTO on the eve of 31 Oct 2011 and notice "Brian's Corner" averaging around 2000 views per month. At this rate by the end of February the view count should have been at around 8000 views, yet now, February not even over yet, it's almost 9500 views which is the end of March's quota if the rate remained the same - an obvious INCREASE in visits - not such a "lonely" place.

An additional 1500 views than initially expected...must be aliens.
Not to mention, at least half the people that comment in this thread thoroughly enjoy your comedic replies, nothing more..nothing less.

You and Phoenix (the NWO scum) are so insulting to everyone who reads the MTO because you think that by throwing negative words at someone, no matter how unfounded or idiotic they are, will turn people against them - the 'throw enough mud and hopefully some of it will stick' principle - very childish of you. If it would work the 'Views' count would not have shown such a significant increase.

Haha, 'NWO scum?' Are you insane or just an idiot? I never said I was totally unaware of the NWO plot. I think you just exaggerate it beyond belief, to the point where you're beginning to sound like those '2012-end of the world' kooks. I do believe that Wall Street heavily influences the policy of the US Government and that politicians are often used simply as the 'public faces,' but spare me your scaremongering.

Throwing negative words at you? I would never do such a thing unless I was attacked or provoked first. Are you forgetting of our first encounters where you had no trouble labelling me as a 'pathetic' individual a mere 10 or so times? I'm beyond the point of showing respect or manners to a dweeb such as yourself.

I told you before, if you don't like "Brian's Corner" stay away, YOU DEFINITELY ARE NOT MISSED.

I find your general posts somewhat boring, but your specific replies to myself never cease to amaze me.

More lies EgejskaMakedonia? - you lie like a Greek!
In YOUR Post179 YOU FIRST mentioned "Ancient Aliens" and George whatever-his-name-is. I HAVE NOT mentioned ANYTHING about aliens AT ALL. Instead EVERYTHING I have said is logical and verifiable facts. The Greeks would love a liar like you - maybe that's why people assume you for a Greek all the time.LOL.

You claim that I am socially inept, yet you struggle to take a joke. The fact that you are so defensive over this 'aliens' business is quite worrying, really.

What a low blow Brian, calling me a Greek. I'm not going to give you the response you crave here.
You have already proved how insensitive and insulting you are when you made your infamous epileptic 'joke.'

Why are you watching it on TV when you mock it? - you must be naturally too stupid to WANT TO waste your time or socially inept that you HAVE NOTHING BETTER to do than waste your time on things you don't like.LOL.

Because, it amuses me how ridiculous some people can be in this world. I also enjoy watching comedy shows. You have already admitted that you are socially and emotionally empty in the 'alternative name' thread, so it's rich coming from a simpleton like you.
Next time I'll walk you to the park and throw you a frisbee. You're free to take photos of it and report Brian's UFO discovery.

I think you are telling people how stupid you are. Unintelligent people are not very welcome at "Brian's Corner".

You know, if you are indeed OziMak (and I honestly have no idea, because I didn't see enough of his posts) then I was one of the few people who were defending you in regards to the name OziMak being changed to FYROM, as well as the avatar, which was also altered. It's actually the moment when I became active in this forum.

I'll actually look through a few of OziMak's posts today and form an opinion on who you really are.

[Brian]

Good question, I have not made any plans beyond 2012 so I guess I might finally have some spare time.

LOL. So great business leader has no 5, 10 and 20 year economic plan? Only ribbing you RtG.

Your popping up here too frequently seems like you're almost showing the slightest bit interest in the 'Red Pill' stuff (you might go kooky according to some). Too bad it wasn't before Vestarec left us. Anyway, I'm sure there will be other things to amuse ourselves with.

[Brian]

do you guys seriously beleive the world is going to end in 2012.What is the cause???What if it doesn't end??

First of all George S. I didn't the world will end in 2012.

Brian Post352
2012 isn't the end of the world, but....

Forget the Hollywood movie "2012"

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1190080/

The world is NOT going to disintegrate into dust as in the movie.
(There is only one part of relevance in that movie but I won't speak of it now as it is not relevant to the point of this post).

There is a lot of misinformation out on the internet so that people get scared and buy some 'nut-jobs' book or view their YouTube clip (yes people make money everytime someone clicks on a Youtube video).

They claim all sorts of things - from the world just blowing up because the Mayans 'said so' to 'Planet X', some say AKA Planet Nibiru, is going to get close enough to effect Earth's gravity and cause earthquakes and tsunamis, to alien invasion because the Earth's alignment to the centre of the Universe in Dec 2012 (scientifically real) will (most likely NOT real) open a portal 'Stargate style' and aliens who supposedly were once here will once again be 'close enough' to come here again, to 'pole shifts' (scientific fact but takes millions of years), to religious nuts who just claim it's 'God's time', ect. Contra to Phoenix's and EgejskaMakedonia's babbling about I'm 'kooky' or something I prefer to look at scientific facts only.

So to answer your question, No, the world is not going to blow up in 2012 but a lot of other real stuff has a good chance of happening. Dig around the internet a bit - it's not hard to find, just steer clear of the kooky stuff like 'aliens', 'Planet X/Nibiru, pole shifts, religious nuts, Mayans, ect.

[Risto the Great]

What if it doesn't end??

Good question, I have not made any plans beyond 2012 so I guess I might finally have some spare time.

[George S.]

do you guys seriously beleive the world is going to end in 2012.What is the cause???What if it doesn't end??