Pavlos Melas - Letters, 1904.

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  • AJ 2000
    Junior Member
    • Sep 2012
    • 9

    #46
    Yes, that's right, or "dark-coloured" - that's the second part of its etymology, explaning its later use as a synonym for things such as treacle in other languages. From what I can work out, its etymology passes through two stages, with a development from a mention in myth, possibly through the unidentified attribution of a particular mythological role to that quality, to its use as a descriptive synonym. By the time "melancholia" is coined, it's already a synonym for dark.
    Last edited by AJ 2000; 09-21-2012, 09:13 AM.

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    • TrueMacedonian
      Senior Member
      • Jan 2009
      • 3810

      #47
      Originally posted by AJ 2000 View Post
      My post wasn't about his fight in Macedonia, which I have no opinion about, but the origin of families of the byzantine bureaucracy.




      A whole quote linking this apparent sentence together is impossible to access - and even it if is a complete sentence rather than a composite search result of separate paragraphs, it's likely not correct. If the Melas family were indeed descended from the Stratigopoulos family of Byzantine officials, its very unlikely they would have been Vlach.
      Why do you say it is very unlikely? And what is your source for this claim? And let's just say that this claim is true then. And? What does it mean? His family may have been Armenian? Albanian? Italian? Arabian? Certainly couldn't have been an ethnic "greek".
      Slayer Of The Modern "greek" Myth!!!

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      • AJ 2000
        Junior Member
        • Sep 2012
        • 9

        #48
        Vlachs were regarded as outsiders by the church hierarchy, simply by virtue of the date of their arrival. As far as ethnicity goes, that's much more difficult. I would think you certainly couldn't completely rule out some kind of link to greek ethnicity, just as you probably couldn't definitively establish it either. That's partly because of particular names and etymologies, and partly because the measure of links between epirus and figures described by non-epirotes as greek, maybe up to epirus vetus, seems less controversial than the areas further east you're interested in on this forum.
        Last edited by AJ 2000; 09-21-2012, 11:13 AM.

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        • TrueMacedonian
          Senior Member
          • Jan 2009
          • 3810

          #49
          Originally posted by AJ 2000 View Post
          Vlachs were regarded as outsiders by the church hierarchy, simply by virtue of the date of their arrival. As far as ethnicity goes, that's much more difficult. I would think you certainly couldn't completely rule out some kind of link to greek ethnicity, just as you probably couldn't definitively establish it either. That's partly because of particular names and etymologies, and partly because the measure of links between epirus and figures described by non-epirotes as greek, maybe up to epirus vetus, seems less controversial than the areas further east you're interested in on this forum.
          Vlachs were considered rebels and troublemakers. BUT you are trying to push off "some kind of link to greek ethnicity" and yet again you do not provide the source I have been asking for.

          Alexander Ypsilantis claimed descent from the East Roman Comnenus family. Historian Steven Runciman says that the Comnenus family were probably Vlach. And we know the Ypsilantis married into Romanian aristocratic families.
          And even those "familial" claims are challenged by scholars today and with good reason.
          Maybe you should investigate the name Melas with the merchant class of orthodox christians.
          Slayer Of The Modern "greek" Myth!!!

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          • George S.
            Senior Member
            • Aug 2009
            • 10116

            #50
            I think you are spot on there TM.I used to know a family who had the surname melas they were italian.The Chances of there being pure greek are pretty slim.There are more chances of him being a vlach.Also mentioned before he wrote in his letters that he learned macedonian.If he was a pure greek why would he bother unless he had a kind of an interest in the matter.TM as usual your reasoning wins the day.
            "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
            GOTSE DELCEV

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            • Epirot
              Member
              • Mar 2010
              • 399

              #51
              Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
              I don't think he was of Macedonian origin because he would not need to learn the simple words he did.

              Probably an Albanian, Vlach or a bit of both.

              Does Melas mean anything in Albanian or Latin?
              As you justly pointed, Mel in Albanian means millet. I have no clue whether Pavlos Melas might have been Albanian. I think he is of Vlach descent. At the Wiki entry it is said that his family came from 'North Epirus', without precising its ethnic background. Many Vlachs from Southern Albania have been activated on Greek bands in Macedonia.
              IF OUR CHRONICLES DO NOT LIE, WE CALL OURSELVES AS EPIROTES!

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              • AJ 2000
                Junior Member
                • Sep 2012
                • 9

                #52
                Originally posted by TrueMacedonian View Post
                Vlachs were considered rebels and troublemakers. BUT you are trying to push off "some kind of link to greek ethnicity" and yet again you do not provide the source I have been asking for.

                No, I was simply saying you can't *exclude* a iink to greek ethnicity with that etymology, in that region at that time . I appreciate this is a sensitive issue on this board, and that's not the main topic of my research ; so I don't want to carry you all off topic for any longer than necessary.
                Last edited by AJ 2000; 09-22-2012, 05:03 AM.

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                • George S.
                  Senior Member
                  • Aug 2009
                  • 10116

                  #53
                  My friend who is italian said in italy it is a common name.He said it's from italy not greek name or albanian or even macedonian name.
                  "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
                  GOTSE DELCEV

                  Comment

                  • TrueMacedonian
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2009
                    • 3810

                    #54
                    Originally posted by AJ 2000 View Post
                    No, I was simply saying you can't *exclude* a iink to greek ethnicity with that etymology, in that region at that time . I appreciate this is a sensitive issue on this board, and that's not the main topic of my research ; so I don't want to carry you all off topic for any longer than necessary.
                    So you cant provide your source?
                    Slayer Of The Modern "greek" Myth!!!

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