Macedonian Truth Forum   

Go Back   Macedonian Truth Forum > Macedonian Truth Forum > На Македонски

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-22-2019, 09:57 PM   #1
vicsinad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,305
vicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud of
Default Vratnicka Enciklopedija

My dad and his friend wrote an encyclopedia on their selo, Vratnica, and it was showcased on Macedonian TV. I uploaded the clip to YouTube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1_-OfEO95s
vicsinad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2019, 06:50 AM   #2
Karposh
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 562
Karposh is on a distinguished road
Default

Thanks for sharing that Vic. I have a lot of time for people who never forget who they are and where they've come from. Preserving Vratnica's history and heritage like that by way of a beautiful, hardcover and glossy tome is invaluable for the next Vratnica generations coming through (I think the guy said that about 90% of Vratnichani currently reside in the U.S.).

They did something similar for my village, Brusnik, back in the 80's to commemorate it's 600 year anniversary of known existence under the name Brusnik. Tradition holds that a much older settlement existed nearby under the name of Lipa. Unfortunately, it's no way near the quality that Vratnichani have been able to produce for their village. The Brusnik booklet is a very simple and basic paper-back edition with hardly any pictures at all. Only the cold hard facts are driven across in a very communist writing style about family clans, economy, agriculture, village traditions, etc. and the one obvious thing it lacks is some warmth and soul. I'm kind of jealous of the Vratnica tome - it's a quality publication. Vratnica is situated in possibly the most beautiful area of Macedonia (on Sharplanina) and you should be rightly proud of your village.

BTW, I couldn't help it, I jumped on Wikipedia to see what they had to say and I had to laugh. This is how they've described Vratnichani:

Quote:
The South Slavic-speaking community is divided between Macedonian and Serbian ethnic identification, although the majority identify as ethnic Macedonians, as indicated in the most recent censuses. Most of the Vratnicani who consider themselves to be Serbian reside in the United States; however, there are still many Vratnicani in the United States who are Macedonian. All practice Orthodox traditions.
That's interesting, I thought. I wonder how much they are divided by. Apparently 482 people declared their ethnicity as Macedonian and, a staggering 20 people declared theirs as Serbs. Looks like the ethnic divisions run deep among the "South-Slavic-speaking community of Vratnica.

Anyway, I checked the Notable people section of Vratnica on Wikipedia and I was really surprised not to see Victor Sinadinovski on the list.
Karposh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2019, 07:30 PM   #3
vicsinad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,305
vicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud of
Default

Karposh:

Thanks for the response! A few things:

1. From Brusnik, eh? In my book The First Macedonian Colony, I did a fairly extensive look into Nick Alabach, or Alabakov, who was arguably the richest Macedonian of his time in America. He came in the early 1900s and was considered the King of the Macedonian Colony in Granite City, Illinois. A very interesting character and probably one of the stand-up Macedonians in the US of his time (1900s-1920s). He's from Brusnik and just wondering if you have any relation to the family!

2. Part of the reason my dad and Stevo wrote the encyclopedia was to instill some pride in the people. Everyone seems so despaired, from economic conditions to the political events of the past few years, so they wanted to rejuvenate the villagers as well as document the history of the selo. (They also sort-of rushed to get the book out because of the name change and Bulgarianization of history, in case the government decides to censor things in the future).

3. Vratnicani in Macedonia are essentially Macedonian, and only a few say they're Serbs. In the US, the majority say they are Serbs or Yugoslavs. A few historically had some ties to Serbia (some to Montenegro), being on the border with Kosovo, but not enough to justify the reason why so many now say they're Serbs. It's a long story that I'll simplify:

Just after World War II, a priest in Vratnica (who was part of the SOC) conspired with some friends to initiate the process of splitting Vratnica from Macedonia and attaching it to Kosovo. With which authorities or group exactly, I don't know. Regardless, my dad's uncle uncovered the plot and informed the Macedonian Communist party officials that this priest and some other Vratnicani wanted to split Vratnica from Macedonia. The priest was caught and sentenced to five years hard labor, and many of those years were spent outdoors near Vratnica where villagers could plainly see him serving his time (I don't know what type of labor exactly). This upset and embarrassed him.

He fled to the US and soon other Vratnicani started coming to the US. He served as a priest in the SOC for a while. Meanwhile, in the 1970s, Macedonians in Detroit were creating their own church. My dad, who was a co-founder of the Mak church, was worried about the Vratnicani joining this Vratnica priest at the SOC church in Detroit (before the MOC church popped up in Detroit, they went either to the SOC or BOC church, with most Vratnicani going to the SOC). My dad proposed building a second Mak church geared toward Vratnicani and neighboring selos so he could pull them from the SOC. A MOC Vratnica church was even registered (ironically, my wife's grandpa, who became a Serboman, was the first to donate to this MOC Vratnica church).

But crap hit the fan. Other Macedonians threatened my dad's life (twice showing up at his house, once causing my grandma to faint) and my dad was forced to let go of the plan to create a MOC church for Vratnicani and surrounding selos. Re-enter this SOC priest who had served hard labor: he began pushing the idea of creating an independent Vratnica Church. Vratnicani, having more "local" pride than national pride at that point, pounced all on the idea. Well, throughout the 1980s and early 1990s, as more Vratnicani joined the church, many become Serbianized (including my wife's grandfather). The Macedonians from surrounding selos didn't want to just go to a Vratnica church, so some left for the new MOC church, but others remained at the SOC church.

At the Vratnica Church in Detroit, I'd say over half who go there say they're Serbs, 1/3 Yugos or just Vratnicani, and 10% Macedonian. Most the ones who say they're Macedonian, however, go to the MOC church.
vicsinad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2019, 08:53 AM   #4
Karposh
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 562
Karposh is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicsinad View Post
...I did a fairly extensive look into Nick Alabach, or Alabakov, who was arguably the richest Macedonian of his time in America. He came in the early 1900s and was considered the King of the Macedonian Colony in Granite City, Illinois. A very interesting character and probably one of the stand-up Macedonians in the US of his time (1900s-1920s). He's from Brusnik and just wondering if you have any relation to the family!
Wow, I had no idea about that fascinating piece of information. And no, no relation unfortunately otherwise "Chiche od Amerika" would take on a whole new meaning for me. I just checked my Brusnik booklet and it talks about the main Brusnik "Rodovi" (i.e. family clan names) but no Alabakovci. I suspect Alabakov was a nickname. Many Brusnichani still go by their age-old nickname instead of their actual family name. Unfortunately, my grandfather passed away about seven years ago so I can't ask him about it otherwise he would've known about him for sure. I'll definitely look into this Nick Alabakov guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicsinad View Post
Vratnicani in Macedonia are essentially Macedonian, and only a few say they're Serbs.
Of course they are Macedonian. I was just being facetious because 20 confused villagers who think they are Serbs compared to 482 Macedonians do not mean a division along ethnic lines in my view. In Brusnik, we have one old geezer who thinks he's a Serb. That doesn't make Brusnik a village divided along ethnic lines either. The guy came back to live in his native village about a decade ago after living most of his life in Belgrade so he's, understandably, a bit confused (or brain-washed).


Quote:
Originally Posted by vicsinad View Post
In the US, the majority say they are Serbs or Yugoslavs. A few historically had some ties to Serbia (some to Montenegro), being on the border with Kosovo, but not enough to justify the reason why so many now say they're Serbs. It's a long story...
I must admit, this was an unexpected twist to the Vratnica story. The divisions, it seems, run deeper in the diaspora than in Macedonia. That's a shame really. At least your family chose the right side. Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, I regard all Macedonian villages along the border with Kosovo and Albania as bastions of Macedonian identity that need to be protected and assisted by the NMK Government at all cost. Macedonia cannot afford to let these villages fall to Albanian expansionism. Sadly, the Macedonian Muslim villages along Albania's border flip flop with their ethnic allegiances so it is up to the Christian ones (what's left of them) to hold the torch for Macedonia.
Karposh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 11:44 AM   #5
vicsinad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,305
vicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud ofvicsinad has much to be proud of
Default

Here's a live stream about the book launch:

https://www.facebook.com/vratnica.li...6798582337917/
vicsinad is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump