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Old 04-30-2011, 05:26 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Prolet View Post
CT, I think your last question is kind of obvious, just look at Greece and Bulgaria how they can barely afford the price rises and they come to Macedonia to do their shopping. Hell the Greeks even fill up their cars with Petrol in Medzitlija.
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Its not obvious - There is nothing unique to shop in a neighbouring country whose prices may be cheaper than its own country. Americans may travel to Canada to shop or buy sevices that are cheaper in Canada than U.S - This is a known fact - Swedes travel to Germany to buy cheaper BMW's or even alcohol for consumption. Danish people buy houses in Sweden because of much better business. Finish people travel to Baltic states to shop select products and services. Some Swedes even travel to Turkey for cheaper dental and beauty services.

Secondly, Greek inflation has indeed risen since the end of 2009, but the rise is not out of order relative to its long term inflation trend. This trend has been falling since early 90's. If anything, Greeks are shopping in Macedonia because they can assess Macedonia's cheap prices. And perhaps they will shop more now when the Greek state is trying to collect ALL taxes. Bottom line, cross border shopping is nothing new and will continue to exist even when prices in Greece and Bulgaria come down.


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Old 04-30-2011, 05:54 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by "Currency" Troll View Post
Which countries have wished they could turned back the hand of time and never join the unioin?.
UK, Germany, France etc. Depends which party you ask.
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Old 04-30-2011, 05:55 AM   #23
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Which countries have wished they could turned back the hand of time and never join the unioin?.
Not exactly answering your specific question but Spain is one major country that is NOT doing all that well in the "great" EU.

Spain jobless rate hits new eurozone record


AP – FILE - In this Feb. 1, 2011 file photo, people queue outside an unemployment office in Madrid. Spain's …

By DANIEL WOOLLS, Associated Press Daniel Woolls, Associated Press – Fri Apr 29

MADRID – Spain's unemployment rate rose sharply to a new eurozone high of 21.3 percent in the first quarter of the year, with a record 4.9 million people out of work, the government said Friday. The rate was the highest reported by the country since 1997.
[...]
In an unemployment line in a working-class Madrid neighborhood, people grimly waiting to sign up for benefit payments said they saw little hope of finding new jobs for years.
[....]
Friday's report said the number of households in which everyone is unemployed rose by 58,000 to about 1.4 million. It is common for young Spaniards to live at home well into their 30s, in part because traditionally it has been so hard for them to find jobs.

[...]

http://news.yahoo.com

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Spain has highest youth unemployment rate in EU
July 24, 2009
A study published by Eurostat shows that 33.6 percent of Spaniards under the age of 24 are now out of work. This is the highest rate in the EU at two thirds of the total number in the euro zone.

The European average rate of youth unemployment stands at 18.3 percent, nearly half that of Spain.
http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90...5/6709104.html
Quote:
Youth unemployment in Spain will remain above 40% until at least 2011.

The Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) said in a working document that this year youth unemployment could be 20.5% on average in its thirty member countries and around 24% for the European Union ( EU), with a peak in Spain, where there could be a turning point in the upward trend at the end of the year.
Youth unemployment in Spain will remain above 40% until at least 2011.

The rate of youth unemployment in Spain, which has been in the OECD's fastest growing percentage since the beginning of the crisis, is forecast to remain above 40% for at least 2011, according to projections released today.
http://www.barcelonareporter.com/ind...at_least_2011/

Greek and Spanish economies falter ahead of expected rise in interest rates

European central bank president Jean-Claude Trichet insists inflation must be quashed


Jobseekers wait for an employment centre to open in Madrid, Spain. Almost five million workers are unemployed in the country. Photograph: Bloomberg/Getty

Greek and Spanish economies falter ahead of expected rise in interest rates


European central bank president Jean-Claude Trichet insists inflation must be quashed

Phillip Inman
guardian.co.uk, Friday 29 April 2011
Spanish Job Centers as Spain Meets Deficit Goal


Europe's north-south divide has worsened as figures show Spain and Greece faltering, with rising unemployment and plummeting retail sales. Meanwhile the European Central Bank (ECB) is preparing to raise interest rates on the back of a booming German economy.

Spain's unemployment rate jumped to a European record of 21.3% last month while Greece's retail sales dropped more than 10% year-on-year as both countries demonstrated the difficulties of spurring economic growth while implementing severe public spending cuts.

Almost five million workers are out of work in Spain, according to official statistics, despite efforts by the socialist-led government to kick-start the economy and generate jobs. Youth unemployment remains above 40%. The gloom in Madrid was reinforced by retail sales data for March, which showed the country's sharpest decline for more than two years.

[....]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...interest-rates

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The rivers of gold that are supposedly to be found over the EU horizon could be nothing more than a mirage or a wild fantasy in someone's deluded mind, IMHO!
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Old 04-30-2011, 07:04 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by DirtyCodingHabitz View Post
UK, Germany, France etc. Depends which party you ask.

Can you support your claims with statements from these countries that they wished they never join the union?







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Old 04-30-2011, 07:10 AM   #25
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Indigen, I asked you a couple of questions before on your previous posting in regards to EU economics and integration, which you either missed or decided to ignore. Shall we take those first?

Indigen previously said/posted:

Quote:
The costs of accession are bound to be crippling: Macedonia’s sheltered and inefficient industries will crumble in the face of European competition; its judiciary and legislature will be buried under the 84,000 pages of the acquis communautaire; environmental, sanitation, and labour rules will render the private sector, such as it is in this benighted place, all but dysfunctional and insolvent; brain drain will likely reach epic proportions. Macedonia is not ready for EU accession. For the time being, it is better off as it is.
Whoever wrote the above passage has missed one big point in all this. Before you can even become a member, the country will have to show some significant readiness and transformation which will be closely inspected that it can handle all or most areas as required. That means each candidate will have to demonstrate that it can absorb or handle 84,000 pages of acquis communautaire, environmental, sanitation or labour rules per EU. This process is lengthy and can take years, if not a full decade before the country is close to become a member. If all goes as it goes now, Macedonia will probably score well on these areas.


As for the argument that Macedonia’s industries will crumble in the face of European competition, which industries is the author talking about?

Is the author suggesting that foreign competition will establish production inside Macedonia and thus knock-out domestic industries?

Or is the author suggesting something else? Can you take his seat to answer these questions?

How did Bulgarian, Romanian, Slovenian, Greek industries handle European competition?

The above passage does not prove that Macedonia will not benefit economically from EU.


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Old 04-30-2011, 07:23 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by "Currency" Troll View Post
Can you support your claims with statements from these countries that they wished they never join the union?.
Parties like UKIP in other countries. I don't know their names or the politicians.

Why don't they put the EU membership to a vote and see how many people want to stay in the EU? They know that people want out of the EU.
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Old 04-30-2011, 08:35 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by indigen View Post
The rivers of gold that are supposedly to be found over the EU horizon could be nothing more than a mirage or a wild fantasy in someone's deluded mind, IMHO!
It`s a marketing strategy to fool poor people`s mind, just like 80`s US movies where you can only see playboy girls in bikinis in Miami.
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Old 04-30-2011, 10:37 AM   #28
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It`s a marketing strategy to fool poor people`s mind, just like 80`s US movies where you can only see playboy girls in bikinis in Miami.
Out of curiosity, have you ever been to Miami?
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Old 04-30-2011, 10:46 AM   #29
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Not exactly answering your specific question but Spain is one major country that is NOT doing all that well in the "great" EU.
Economic bad news is just that, and it's easy to show pretty picture illustrating it, but is there anything to say it's due to being in the EU ONLY? or is it just bad economic management leads to bad economic news, like in any (EU and non-EU) country? Remember 2008/09?
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Old 04-30-2011, 01:56 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Risto the Great View Post


Here is something I was reading whilst in China in relation to their new foreign aid policy:

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/opinion...t_12374296.htm

Money clearly exists out there WITHOUT a requirement to prostitute our identity it would seem. But CT seems to like it EU style.



I think the EU's future is clearly uncertain, but it's hardly a "doomed" organization. This story is going to play out for years. In the meantime, Macedonia's government should definitely work to implement economic and judicial reforms suggested by an EU accession process, not because the EU wants them to, but because it will actually develop and strengthen Macedonia's economy, and improve stability and the nation's prospects, regardless of whether or not they are ever members.

The economic woes in places like Greece are due to a combination of the senior partners being asleep at the switch in monitoring what was going on, and the junior partner simply lying through its teeth for 20 years. I am fairly sure that compliance with EU financial regulations will be better monitored for now on, since the 2008 meltdown, and that cheating the system will not be so easy.

However, this idea about Chinese foreign aid being without strings attached is very unconvincing! I think all countries attach strings to their foreign aid, why would China be any different? It seems that foreign aid relationships tend be chronic in nature, and never achieve the goal of actually pulling a country out of poverty, without a successful economic development plan.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but China's most lucrative international economic relationships involve taking massive amounts of resources from resource-rich countries, and returning cheap manufactured goods in return, which is achieved through its massive labor pool, and its utter lack of human rights, minority rights, worker's rights and environmental protections.

Isn't it true that Macedonia has no such resources to offer the benevolent Emperors in Beijing? Does it have a significant market to purchase such goods with on a large scale? Does it have any other valuable connections to China - geographically, politically, culturally?

I've heard a little bit about a factory built in one of Gruevski's "tax-free zones" by Haier, and a few other China-related initiatives. I suppose the idea is that Chinese foreign investment would create badly needed manufacturing jobs in Macedonia. But if that's the case, and Macedonia wants to build an export based economy on relatively low labor costs, the countries it will be exporting to will all be EU countries, won't they?
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