International Court of Justice - Macedonia and Greece

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  • NikodimMKD
    Banned
    • Apr 2009
    • 187

    #31
    Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
    Bu the leader of Greece said there was a VETO.
    And the NATO General Secretary will have to prove his assertions in court as to whether a VETO occurred. Bearing in mind he was the same person saying Macedonia was completely eligible.

    You are really going to have to back your statements up Niko.
    NATO keeps transcripts and archives of all their meetings. If there was a vote on the admission of Macedonia into NATO, the practicals of that vote would have recorded that greece vetoed Macedonia's admission.

    I don't think we have a case at the IJC based on hearsay and rumours. Macedonia might be able to show "intent" based on statements, but not sure what else we can prove.

    Comment

    • Rogi
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2008
      • 2343

      #32
      Well, look at it this way...

      Every NATO member, including Greece, agreed that Macedonia met all the criteria for joining NATO.

      The reason why Macedonia was not invited to join NATO, was because of the name, i.e. the dispute with Greece over the name.

      Now that means, there was an objection to Macedonia joining NATO, because of the name. Even if ALL of the members of NATO objected to Macedonia joining, that means Greece too objected. Given NATO's 'unanimous' decision making process, this means that all of NATO objected to Macedonia joining, and that includes Greece.

      Now, of all the NATO members, Greece is the only one which has signed an agreement that it will not object to Macedonia joining any international organisation which Greece is member to, that is, if Macedonia applies under the interim name.

      Comment

      • NikodimMKD
        Banned
        • Apr 2009
        • 187

        #33
        Originally posted by Rogi View Post
        Well, look at it this way...

        Every NATO member, including Greece, agreed that Macedonia met all the criteria for joining NATO.

        The reason why Macedonia was not invited to join NATO, was because of the name, i.e. the dispute with Greece over the name.

        Now that means, there was an objection to Macedonia joining NATO, because of the name. Even if ALL of the members of NATO objected to Macedonia joining, that means Greece too objected. Given NATO's 'unanimous' decision making process, this means that all of NATO objected to Macedonia joining, and that includes Greece.

        Now, of all the NATO members, Greece is the only one which has signed an agreement that it will not object to Macedonia joining any international organisation which Greece is member to, that is, if Macedonia applies under the interim name.
        A court ruling which is not even enforcable will not give us legitimacy, nor will it prevent the greeks from future vetos in the EU or NATO.

        I think this whole process is a waste of time and money. We have other more important matters to deal with.

        Why do we need a court ruling to abandon the interim agreement?

        Comment

        • Daskalot
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 4345

          #34
          Nikos for how long are you going to play this little game of yours?

          I will ask you a question and you better answer it;

          Why are you pretending to be a Macedonian?
          Macedonian Truth Organisation

          Comment

          • NikodimMKD
            Banned
            • Apr 2009
            • 187

            #35
            Originally posted by Daskalot View Post
            Nikos for how long are you going to play this little game of yours?

            I will ask you a question and you better answer it;

            Why are you pretending to be a Macedonian?
            My name is not Nikos, it's Nikodim which is a different name. Second, I am not pretending to be Macedonian. I am Macedonian.

            Comment

            • Daskalot
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 4345

              #36
              Originally posted by NikodimMKD View Post
              My name is not Nikos, it's Nikodim which is a different name. Second, I am not pretending to be Macedonian. I am Macedonian.
              Good for you and as a Macedonian, I must assume that you are a speaker of the language, could you please share some sentences with us in our native tongue?
              Macedonian Truth Organisation

              Comment

              • NikodimMKD
                Banned
                • Apr 2009
                • 187

                #37
                Originally posted by Daskalot View Post
                Good for you and as a Macedonian, I must assume that you are a speaker of the language, could you please share some sentences with us in our native tongue?
                I already explained to Soldier that my grandfather was Macedonian from Bitola, but the other members of my family are Brazilian of different backgrounds, so I don't speak it just like the majority of Australian or Canadian Macedonian youths.

                The Albanians in Macedonia can speak Macedonian better than most people in here. Are they more Macedonian than most in here as well?

                Comment

                • Daskalot
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 4345

                  #38
                  Originally posted by NikodimMKD View Post
                  I already explained to Soldier that my grandfather was Macedonian from Bitola, but the other members of my family are Brazilian of different backgrounds, so I don't speak it just like the majority of Australian or Canadian Macedonian youths.

                  The Albanians in Macedonia can speak Macedonian better than most people in here. Are they more Macedonian than most in here as well?
                  Aha, so you are 1/4 Macedonian but very versed in the whole "Macedonian Question" funny that.... your grandfather must have taught you well but forgot to teach you the language.... strange.

                  Are you speaking Portuguese then? How much do you know about current and historical events in Brazil??

                  Are you an Inca tribes member?
                  Macedonian Truth Organisation

                  Comment

                  • Risto the Great
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 15658

                    #39
                    Ah we might as well argue with Nikodim.
                    I have seen real Macedonians with more questionable motives. And it does allow us to explain the real Macedonian perspective.

                    Niko, you said we will lose the case. Now you say it won't matter if we win. Your conversations are a little tiresome.

                    I agree with you, we should withdraw from anything resembling negotiation. We Macedonians stand on higher moral ground. I am sure you agree.
                    Risto the Great
                    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                    Comment

                    • Soldier of Macedon
                      Senior Member
                      • Sep 2008
                      • 13670

                      #40
                      ..........I don't speak it just like the majority of Australian or Canadian Macedonian youths.
                      Easy there champ, most Macedonian youth still speak Macedonian in Australia and Canada, obviously not as good as those in Macedonia, but still conversant in the language.
                      In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                      Comment

                      • Dejan
                        Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 589

                        #41
                        Originally posted by NikodimMKD View Post
                        ...I don't speak it just like the majority of Australian or Canadian Macedonian youths.
                        I am yet to meet an Australian Macedonian who doesn't speak Macedonian
                        You want Macedonia? Come and take it from my blood!

                        A prosperous, independent and free Macedonia for Macedonians will be the ultimate revenge to our enemies.

                        Comment

                        • Risto the Great
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 15658

                          #42
                          I have met a few.
                          Some Egejci are 3rd or 4th generation in Australia now.
                          It is certainly possible.
                          Risto the Great
                          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                          Comment

                          • Soldier of Macedon
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 13670

                            #43
                            Yes for 3rd and 4th generation, but for 1st and 2nd? Even those that have one grandparent of Macedonian origin can generally utter a few words out, unless they live in Brazil.
                            In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                            Comment

                            • VMRO
                              Senior Member
                              • Sep 2008
                              • 1462

                              #44
                              Name negotiations to be frozen until Hague court judgment



                              The name negotiations between Macedonia and Greece will be frozen until a judgment of the International Court of Justice in The Hague, Macedonian Vecer daily writes.
                              “In the past 14 years not a single Greek proposal has been as humiliating and ultimate as this one. It is not about negotiations or an ultimatum, but rather about a voluntary rejection of the Macedonian language and Macedonian nation. Macedonia does not have a choice and has to wait for the decision of the Hague-based court. What have the U.S. and Brussels been doing in the meantime,” the newspaper writes.
                              Vecer daily says that unlike the image of the new government and prime minister, who leaves the impression of a more pragmatic politician, the position of official Athens is apparently more extreme.
                              Last edited by Soldier of Macedon; 11-16-2009, 08:31 AM. Reason: Article from link added.
                              Verata vo Mislite, VMRO vo dushata, Makedonia vo Srceto.

                              Vnatreshna Makedonska Revolucionerna Organizacija.

                              Comment

                              • BigMak
                                Banned
                                • Jan 2009
                                • 209

                                #45
                                I dont get it.

                                Why would the Hagues judgment have any influence on greeces objection to a sovereign independent neighboring country. What does it have to do with it?

                                Comment

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