Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI)

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  • Risto the Great
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 15658

    Bulgaria had way too much Russian familiarity.
    Letting them into the EU was a useful way to curb that threat in my opinion.
    Originally posted by Starling View Post
    For some reason I didn't realize Bulgaria joined the EU too. It's bad enough that Greece made it in but you'd think Bulgaria wouldn't have enough people in their back pocket to buy their way in while Macedonia supposedly fails to meet standards.
    Risto the Great
    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

    Comment

    • maco2envy
      Member
      • Jan 2015
      • 288

      Call me a conspiracist, but I feel like someone (or a few) with close relations to the Bulgarian government regularly updates the following wikipedia article which mind you, is saturated in propaganda:



      This is where I first heard about the apparent recognition of a "Bulgarian minority" in Albania, even before Borissovs tweet. I regularly checked the page for activity after I did a small clean up of the article a couple of weeks ago...

      ... Or it could just be bulgarian nationalists that are serious about the issue and have too much time on their hands...

      Comment

      • Liberator of Makedonija
        Senior Member
        • Apr 2014
        • 1595

        Where the fuck are these Bulgarians in Albania hahah someone point them out to me
        I know of two tragic histories in the world- that of Ireland, and that of Macedonia. Both of them have been deprived and tormented.

        Comment

        • Albo
          Member
          • May 2014
          • 304

          Some people do identity as Bulgarian,
          Mostly as Macedonian though..

          Comment

          • Starling
            Member
            • Sep 2017
            • 153

            Originally posted by maco2envy View Post
            Call me a conspiracist, but I feel like someone (or a few) with close relations to the Bulgarian government regularly updates the following wikipedia article which mind you, is saturated in propaganda:



            This is where I first heard about the apparent recognition of a "Bulgarian minority" in Albania, even before Borissovs tweet. I regularly checked the page for activity after I did a small clean up of the article a couple of weeks ago...

            ... Or it could just be bulgarian nationalists that are serious about the issue and have too much time on their hands...
            I've seen wikipedia pages mention a 'greco-bactrian' empire and the German Aryan theory as an actual thing. Those same pages tend to twist any sufficiently known information contradicting them as 'controversial' or 'disproven' or 'not widely believed' either citing propaganda or failing to elaborate at all. There also seem to be hordes of trolls harassing anyone who so much as says Macedonians aren't Greek no matter what site you're on so clearly there are people willing to waste their time on bullshit like that.

            Comment

            • maco2envy
              Member
              • Jan 2015
              • 288

              Originally posted by Starling View Post
              I've seen wikipedia pages mention a 'greco-bactrian' empire and the German Aryan theory as an actual thing. Those same pages tend to twist any sufficiently known information contradicting them as 'controversial' or 'disproven' or 'not widely believed' either citing propaganda or failing to elaborate at all. There also seem to be hordes of trolls harassing anyone who so much as says Macedonians aren't Greek no matter what site you're on so clearly there are people willing to waste their time on bullshit like that.
              Yeah I think the common consensus should be that wikipedia is generally a trash resource for history and politics.

              For example even this page:



              avoids clearly stating there was a Slavic speaking majority in "Greek Macedonia" like the plague, which is contrary to 95% of the ethnographic maps and data presented on the same page. It instead uses data published by a Greek author and data from the 'League of Nations', which was a political organisation focused on ending the first world war (i.e Bulgaria to pull out from obtaining Aegean Macedonia) to justify a Greek majority in Aegean Macedonia. Their data is so far-fetched it states Macedonians (labeled as Bulgarians) only composing of 5% percent of the overall population, while Greeks are at 88%. An obvious fabrication of reality, without of course a 'controversial/not widely believed' tag.

              You'd actually think those from the League of Nations whom constructed this fabricated data would have been a bit more smarter and stated there was at least like 35% Macedonians and way more Muslims (laughably listed as 0.1%) to make it more believable. But again, wikipedia states these as fact.

              I'm really starting to get the gist that wikipedia is a propaganda platform and that it's even worse than the nationalistic sites out there because it is disguised as a neutral resource and that it is the first place people generally flock to for some quick "insight".

              Comment

              • Starling
                Member
                • Sep 2017
                • 153

                A list of censuses specifying which ones are accurate and which ones aren't and why would help sort out which statistics are trustworthy and which ones aren't. It'd also help illustrate how many people had conflicting political motivations in falsifying information about Macedonia like that one chart I saw once comparing Greece, Serbia and Bulgaria's pre-1913 censuses of Macedonia with each other and another party. The demographic maps can get confusing when the image quality makes it harder to tell certain patterns or words apart.

                Yeah. The only reason I still look at pages about stuff like 'Greek' mythology and stuff about Macedonia at this point is to get a list of names and terms to research elsewhere or laugh at how self-contradicting some of them are. Last I checked the one on Epirus called them Greek while saying they were called barbarians one sentence later. At least the page on Pandora mentioned evidence of a reversal of the original myth I'd like to look into sometime. The etymology for a number of gods' names were listed as 'pre-Greek' despite constant references of the Mycenaean language as a form of early Greek despite Greek substituting a term that didn't exist yet.

                I've noticed the concerning issue that propaganda dominates mainstream information sources and that the narrative is also propagated in popculture through popularization of 'Greek' mythology. Most sites with accurate information about Macedonia tend to be outdated or the links are broken. These days social media is unavoidable and probably the most likely manner of getting more people to become aware of the situation. Another benefit of using social media would be to improve networking with other Macedonians, which is sorely needed to address various problems. Even this site is likely to be overlooked by a number of people who look at the last article dated at 2010 and don't look at the forums. And that's not even getting into the state of history classes. If the political situation is stuck in the status quo, we can at least work on making accurate information on Macedonia more readily available to the average person around the world so more people will be aware enough of the situation to stop contributing to the problem.

                Comment

                • MHRMI
                  Member
                  • Dec 2009
                  • 132

                  The Republican Party Has Hung Macedonia Out to Dry

                  The Republican Party Has Hung Macedonia Out to Dry

                  November 2, 2017 /MHRMI/ -- For some unknown reason, the Soros/Hillary/Obama policy in Macedonia is still in place (let's call it SHO since Americans seem to like acronyms) and the Republican Party is doing nothing about it. Well, they started to – by launching a Congressional investigation into SHO meddling in Macedonia – but they seem to have gotten distracted by a squirrel or a Trump.

                  The assumption that a country like Macedonia would be ignored by US foreign policy is an argument made by the naive. American foreign policy is one of foreign interventionism, everywhere, and the examples abound going back seven decades – including a multitude in Macedonia the past several years. We are dealing with something different here and the crucial question is: Why has the GOP completely capitulated to a Democratic Party policy and allowed a SHO-instigated, left-wing coup to go unchallenged? There are only two options - incompetence or complicity.

                  I never would have imagined that complicity would be possible until Secretary of State Tillerson congratulated the new SHO-installed Macedonian “Prime Minister” on winning a non-existent mandate. His party actually lost the parliamentary election, but the US State Department ensured that a pro-SHO, left-wing coalition would govern Macedonia. Mr. Tillerson, correct me if I'm wrong in suggesting that you're complicit. Could it be incompetence instead? Better yet, simply direct the State Department to follow YOUR policy and end the unrelenting attacks on Macedonians' identity and independence.

                  Excuse my anger – or don't, quite frankly, I don't care - because my country's name, ethnic origin, language, identity and territorial integrity are being threatened in order to fulfill an American foreign policy objective of denying the existence of Macedonians all to appease our oppressors – Bulgaria, Albania and Greece. BAG, if you will. But let's not overdo the acronyms, it would just confuse POTUS – if he's paying attention.

                  Macedonia is our name. Macedonian is our ethnicity. They always have been. I explain the idiocy of the artificially-created, anti-Macedonian “name dispute”, which is at the heart of the crisis in Macedonia and the region, in this op-ed in The Hill. Defending the existence of my, or any, ethnic group should not be necessary.

                  Another op-ed of mine in The Hill calls on Donald Trump to reverse the damage done in Macedonia by the previous US administration. Well, unless white supremacists, the NFL, or Bob Corker are involved – Trump won't act. Mr. Corker, maybe I can teach you a few choice Macedonian words to tweet at Trump to get his attention. Tweet me.

                  Or how about the GOP actually steps in and finishes its Congressional investigation – a few months ago. Wait, you've already wasted enough time and we already know what the outcome would be. Mike Lee, Ted Cruz and the others who started the investigation, act NOW. Macedonia and Macedonians need you to literally save our country and ethnic group from extinction. All you have to do is announce that the United States defends Macedonia's most basic human right – our right to exist – and that the US demands an immediate end to the racist, anti-Macedonian name negotiations. One sentence will save a country. And it can be done in 140 characters or less.

                  Bill Nicholov, President
                  Macedonian Human Rights Movement International

                  --- Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI) has been active on human and national rights issues for Macedonians and other oppressed peoples since 1986. For more information: 1-416-850-7125, [email protected], www.mhrmi.org, www.twitter.com/mhrmi, www.facebook.com/mhrmi, www.mhrmi.org/OurNameIsMacedonia

                  Републиканската партија ја остави Македонија на цедило

                  Од непознати причини, политиката на Сорос, Хилари и Обама се' уште е на сила во Македонија (ќе ја наречеме оваа политика „СХО“, бидејќи Американците се чини дека сакаат акроними), а Републиканската партија не сака да стори ништо во врска со тоа. Добро, почнаа да се занимаваат со тоа, со тоа што започнаа истрага во Конгресот за мешањето на СХО во Македонија, но изгледа дека вниманието им го одвлече некоја верверичка или Трамп.

                  Претпоставката дека земја како Македонија не е од интерес на американската надворешна политика е аргумент на наивните. Американската надворешна политика е политика на интервенционизам, секаде, за што има неброени примери од изминатите седумдесет години, вклучително и многубројни примери во Македонија во последните неколку години. Сега се соочуваме со нешто поинакво, па клучното прашање е: Зошто Републиканската партија толку целосно и' се предаде на политиката на Демократската партија и дозволи непречен државен преврат предводен од СХО? Постојат само две опции: некомпетентност или соучесништво.

                  Не можев ниту да замислам дека соучесништвото е можна опција се' додека Државниот Секретар Тилерсон не му честиташе на новиот македонски „Премиер“, поставен од СХО, за освојувањето на непостоечкиот мандат. Неговата партија всушност ги изгуби парламентарните избори, но Стејт Департментот на САД се потруди про-СХО, левичарска коалиција сепак да ја раководи Македонија. Господине Тилерсон, поправете ме ако грешам дека сте соучесник. Можно ли е да се работи за некомпетентност? Најдобро е да му укажете на Стејт Департментот да ја следи ВАШАТА политика и да престане со неуморните напади на македонскиот идентитет и независност.

                  Простете ми го гневот - или немојте, искрено, не ми е гајле - зашто името на мојата земја, нејзиното етничко потекло, јазик, идентитет и територијален интегритет се под закана за да се исполни целта на американската надворешна политика да се негира постоењето на македонците за да им се удоволи на нашите потчинители, Бугарија, Албанија и Грција. БАГ, ако сакате. Или да не претеруваме со акронимите, да не го збуниме Претседателот на САД, ако случајно ни обраќа внимание.

                  Македонија е нашето име. Нашата етничка припадност е македонска. Од секогаш било така. Го објаснив идиотизмот на вештачки создаденото, анти-македонско „прашање за името“, кое е во суштината на кризата во Македонија и регионот, во оваа колумна во The Hill. Не би требало да постои потреба да се брани постоењето на мојата или која било друга етничка група.

                  Во една друга моја колумна во The Hill го повикав Доналд Трамп да ја поправи штетата што на Македонија и' ја нанесе претходната администрација на САД. Но, ете, Трамп не дејствува освен ако не се работи за НФЛ, белите националисти, или Боб Коркер. Господине Коркер, можеби можам да ве научам неколку македонски одбрани зборови да му ги напишете на Трамп на Твитер за да му го привлечете вниманието. Пишете ми на Твитер.

                  А може и Републиканската партија да се заангажира и да ја заврши истрагата во Конгресот - уште пред неколку месеци. Но почекајте, веќе потрошивте премногу време и веќе го знаеме исходот. Мајк Ли, Тед Круз и другите што ја започнаа истрагата треба да дејствуваат СЕГА. Македонија и Македонците бараат буквално да ја спасите нашата земја и етничка група од истребување. Се' што треба да сторите е да потенцирате дека САД застанува во одбрана на нашите најосновни човекови права - нашето право да постоиме - и дека САД бара веднаш да престанат расистичките, анти-македонски преговори за името. Една реченица ќе ја спаси нашата земја. За само 140 знаци или и помалку од тоа.

                  Бил Николов
                  Македонско Меѓународно Движење за Човекови Права

                  Comment

                  • maco2envy
                    Member
                    • Jan 2015
                    • 288

                    We all know about wikipedia being a pedestal for propaganda, but the Bulgarian wikipedia takes it to new lengths.

                    Wikiproject: 'Macedonia' where "the number of articles has doubled over the last six years. In addition to quantity, articles can also be proud of their quality, a testimony of which is the fact that even leading scientists in the field. In practice, this is the most serious and complete online reader on the Macedonian issue." (Rough translation)

                    Over 8% of articles (20,000+) in bg.wikipedia relate to Macedonia:

                    Comment

                    • Liberator of Makedonija
                      Senior Member
                      • Apr 2014
                      • 1595

                      Originally posted by maco2envy View Post
                      We all know about wikipedia being a pedestal for propaganda, but the Bulgarian wikipedia takes it to new lengths.

                      Wikiproject: 'Macedonia' where "the number of articles has doubled over the last six years. In addition to quantity, articles can also be proud of their quality, a testimony of which is the fact that even leading scientists in the field. In practice, this is the most serious and complete online reader on the Macedonian issue." (Rough translation)

                      Over 8% of articles (20,000+) in bg.wikipedia relate to Macedonia:
                      http://bg.wikipedia.org/wiki/Уикипедия:Македония

                      Just a little obsessed.....
                      I know of two tragic histories in the world- that of Ireland, and that of Macedonia. Both of them have been deprived and tormented.

                      Comment

                      • Starling
                        Member
                        • Sep 2017
                        • 153

                        Definitely obsessed and the Greeks have taken to parroting it too.

                        Comment

                        • MHRMI
                          Member
                          • Dec 2009
                          • 132

                          The Latest Our Name Is Macedonia Billboards Go Up Throughout Macedonia!



                          End the Anti-Macedonian Name Negotiations Now - The Latest Our Name Is Macedonia Billboards Go Up Throughout Macedonia


                          Македонската верзија е подолу (Macedonian version is below)

                          (January 4, 2018) - The latest version of MHRMI's Our Name Is Macedonia billboards - demanding an immediate end to the racist, anti-Macedonian name negotiations - have gone up in 14 cities throughout Macedonia. See the list below. Despite the US State Department/Zoran Zaev ban on freedom of the media and freedom of expression, we fully expect and DEMAND that the media cover this crucial development in the defence of an entire country and people's right to exist.

                          We call on any media outlet that has been threatened to contact us so we can further expose the anti-democratic and anti-Macedonian activities of the current regime during our continuous meetings with the highest-levels of Western governments.

                          The billboard states:
                          • Do not be fooled by the terms "International, Bilateral and Constitutional"
                          • If Macedonia's name is changed anywhere, it will be changed everywhere and forever
                          • Do you want to be known as "New Macedonians", "North Macedonians", "Skopjans", "Vardarians", or SIMPLY MACEDONIANS?


                          As MHRMI has repeatedly warned, it is now been made public that Macedonia's name, identity, language and history are being negotiated away to appease our oppressors.

                          We fully expect and demand an immediate defence of our most basic right of human rights, self-identification and self-determination, and our right to exist as who we have always been - Macedonians. Demand an end to the name negotiations NOW.

                          * Billboards are in Skopje, Prilep, Bitola, Resen, Ohrid, Struga, Kicevo, Gostivar, Tetovo, Kumanovo, Strumica, Kocani, Stip and Gevgelija

                          --- Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI) has been active on human and national rights issues for Macedonians and other oppressed peoples since 1986. For more information: 1-416-850-7125, [email protected], www.mhrmi.org, www.twitter.com/mhrmi, www.facebook.com/mhrmi, www.instagram.com/MacedonianHumanRights, www.mhrmi.org/OurNameIsMacedonia

                          Прекинете ги веднаш антимакедонските преговори за името - Нови билборди „Нашето име е Македонија“ се поставени низ цела Македонија

                          Најновата верзија на билбордите на ММДЧП „Нашето име е Македонија“, со коишто се бара итен прекин на расистичките и антимакедонски преговори за името, се прошири во 14 градови низ Македонија. Погледнете ја подолу листата на градови (*). И покрај тоа што Стејт Департментот и Зоран Заев забранија слобода во медиумите и слобода на изразување, ние во целост очекуваме и бараме од медиумите да го покриваат овој круцијален развој во одбраната на една земја и правото на еден народ да постои.

                          Од сите медиуми на кои што добиле закани ги повикуваме да не’ контактираат, со цел да можеме понатаму да ги изложуваме антидемократските и антимакедонски активности на сегашниот режим при нашите редовни средби на највисоко ниво со ‘западните’ влади.

                          Билбордите ги содржат следниве пораки:
                          • Не дозволувајте да бидете измамени со термините "меѓународна, билатерална и уставна"
                          • Ако името на Македонија се смени за било каква употреба, тоа ќе се смени секаде и засекогаш
                          • Дали сакате да бидете познати како „Новомакедонци", „Северомакедонци", „Скопјани", „Вардарци", или едноставно МАКЕДОНЦИ?


                          Она што ММДЧП постојано го предупредуваше, сега е и јавно објавено. дека македонското име, идентитетот, јазикот и историјата се предмет на преговори, со цел да се задоволат нашите угнетувачи.

                          Во целост очекуваме и бараме жестока одбрана на нашите најосновни човекови права, самоидентификација и самоопределување, како и одбрана на нашето право да бидеме она што отсекогаш сме биле - Македонци. Барајте крај на преговорите за името СЕГА.

                          * Билборди се поставени во градовите: Скопје, Прилеп, Битола, Ресен, Охрид, Струга, Кичево, Гостивар, Тетово, Куманово, Струмица, Кочани, Штип и Гевгелија.

                          --- Македонското меѓународно движење за човекови права (ММДЧП) активно работи на полето на човекови и национални права на Македонците и другите обесправени народи од своето основање во 1986 година. За повеќе информации: 1-416-850-7125, [email protected], www.mhrmi.org, www.twitter.com/mhrmi, https://www.facebook.com/mhrmi,insta...ianHumanRights, www.mhrmi.org/OurNameIsMacedonia

                          Comment

                          • Risto the Great
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 15658

                            Fabulous effort!
                            Can we see some pictures in situ?
                            Risto the Great
                            MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                            "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                            Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                            Comment

                            • Starling
                              Member
                              • Sep 2017
                              • 153

                              How has MHRMI been faring with the censorship specifically targeting it? If anyone's got a link to a good article about that policy in particular It'd be nice to pass around alongside the our name is Macedonia stuff.

                              Comment

                              • MHRMI
                                Member
                                • Dec 2009
                                • 132

                                Thanks. Please see our response to misinformation from The Guardian that details the media ban:
                                Response to Patrick Wintour's 'Macedonia says it needs prospect of joining EU to thwart authoritarianism” The original article in 'The Guardian' The article 'Macedonia says it needs prospect of joining EU to thwart authoritarianism” by Patrick Wintour, which was published in the Guardian on 15 December 2017 is a sloppy ...


                                We have pics of the actual billboards in different cities throughout Macedonia here:
                                Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI) is dedicated to pursuing all fundamental human and national rights including the right of freedom of expression and association and to support all democratic principles for all ethnic Macedonians living in Greece, Bulgaria and Albania.


                                We'll be posting more soon and will put some on the MTO forum.

                                Comment

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