Jovan Vraniskovski - The Traitor

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  • lavce pelagonski
    Senior Member
    • Nov 2009
    • 1993

    Оперативна акција „*асколник„ - YouTube
    Стравот на Атина од овој Македонец одел до таму што го нарекле Страшниот Чакаларов гркоубиец и крвожеден комитаџија.

    Ако знам дека тука тече една капка грчка крв, јас сега би ја отсекол целата рака и би ја фрлил в море. Васил Чакаларов

    Comment

    • lavce pelagonski
      Senior Member
      • Nov 2009
      • 1993

      A site of hate: orthodoxchristianity.net

      I recently joined the forum
      Code:
      www.orthodoxchristianity.net
      .

      As I started to read some of their thread on Macedonia it became very clear to me that it was run by Greeks and Serbs which deny the MOC but love Vranishkovski. Even on a forum that is supposedly meant to be full of understanding and tolerant people I fund the same sum.

      They gave me a warning because I didnt give Jovan a title

      30 days for no title.

      "Secondly Archbishop Jovan (Vranishkovski) is a tool used by the Serbian church to create a new Macedonian church that would adhere to there rules and would directly be under their jurisdiction. Also he did commit all those crimes that is why he is in jail."

      Title inserted by moderator.

      You are put on warning status for 30 days for not using titles. If you wish to contest this action, please PM me. Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)
      Code:
      http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,47653.msg880479.html#msg880479
      They locked me out of the thread about the Nis dogovor and other threads that I can no longer see.
      Last edited by Orovnichanec; 02-13-2013, 01:04 PM. Reason: Put the links in code box
      Стравот на Атина од овој Македонец одел до таму што го нарекле Страшниот Чакаларов гркоубиец и крвожеден комитаџија.

      Ако знам дека тука тече една капка грчка крв, јас сега би ја отсекол целата рака и би ја фрлил в море. Васил Чакаларов

      Comment

      • George S.
        Senior Member
        • Aug 2009
        • 10116

        tis a saying be carefull of a sheep in wolf's clothing it s so true in this case.here
        "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
        GOTSE DELCEV

        Comment

        • Makedonska_Kafana
          Senior Member
          • Aug 2010
          • 2642

          When, you come across these types of sites you should always "code" the link so you don't give them free exposure.
          http://www.makedonskakafana.com

          Macedonia for the Macedonians

          Comment

          • DedoAleko
            Member
            • Jun 2009
            • 969

            google translate:

            MOC-OA demands release of Vranishkovski

            "The Holy Synod of MOC-OA serving God and led by the spirit of philanthropy, but for higher goals, urges the competent authorities of the Republic of Macedonia for mercy in terms of the closed former Bishop John, for offenses which convicted serving a prison sentence . In these holy days before Christmas, should not be deprived of the hope for mercy, "the statement said.

            The application of MPC was followed after the saturday visit of Skopje to the President of the Department of Foreign Affairs of the Moscow Patriarchate and the most influential Russian metropolitans Volokolamsko Hilarion Alefeev.

            извор: http://makfax.com.mk/makedonija/mpc-...a-vraniskovski

            Comment

            • Risto the Great
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 15658

              "MOC-OA serving God and led by the spirit of philanthropy" .... and bowing down to Russian pressure.



              I wonder what else the MOCOA would be willing to do to win favour with influential churchy type people.
              Risto the Great
              MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
              "Holding my breath for the revolution."

              Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

              Comment

              • Big Bad Sven
                Senior Member
                • Jan 2009
                • 1528

                Russian Cleric Urges Macedonia to Free Priest

                A high-level Russian Orthodox cleric urged Macedonian leaders to free Jovan Vraniskovski, a controversial priest who is serving a jail sentence for embezzlement

                Metropolitan Hilarion Alefeev of Volokolamsk, seen as one of the most influential figures in the Russian Orthodox Church and head of its external relations department, urged Macedonian leaders to release Vraniskovski in order to help the countrys church settle its status in the Orthodox world, a well-informed source from the Macedonian Church told BIRN.

                During his stay in Macedonia over the weekend, Hilarion repeated this request to President Gjorge Ivanov, Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski and Bishop Clemet of the Macedonian Church, the source said under condition of anonymity.

                The topic of conversation was the settlement of the canonical status of the [Macedonian] church, which is outside of communion with the Orthodox world, the Russian Church said in its official statement.

                For almost a decade, Vraniskovski has been the focus of a dispute between the Macedonian Orthodox Church and its Serbian counterpart, which does not recognise Macedonia's ecclesiastical independence, known as autocephaly.

                The more influential Serbian Orthodox Church, which has much better relations with the Russian Church, has said it will only offer its Macedonian counterpart autonomy.

                In July 2013, Skopjes criminal court convicted Vraniskovski to three years in prison for embezzling some 250,000 euro from the Macedonian Orthodox Church in 2002, before he defected to set up his own church.

                Vraniskovski, who pleaded not guilty, claims he was put on trial because he defected from the Macedonian Orthodox Church and formed the unregistered parallel Orthodox Ohrid Archdiocese, which was supported by the Serbian church.



                Macedonian PM Nikola Gruevski and Metropolitan Hilarion | Photo by: Russian Orthodox Church


                The Russian cleric also met Vraniskovski on Sunday in the Skopje clinical centre, the Church said, without giving any further details. It also remains unclear why the incarcerated Vraniskovski was in hospital.

                The Macedonian authorities were also silent about details of the visit, which came just weeks after Vraniskovski claimed he has been tortured in prison and said he feared for his life. He blamed the Macedonian authorities for his treatment.

                For all that is happening to me, I cannot unconditionally blame the prison warden or the Directorate for Sanctions. What can they do when in this country of ours laws can be bent with a single telephone call coming from above? Vraniskovski asked.

                The authorities denied the allegations.

                The Orthodox Ohrid Archdiocese called Vraniskovskis trial politically motivated and said his jailing showed that the country's courts are used to protect the monopoly of the schismatic Macedonian Orthodox Church.

                The Serbian Orthodox Church has also demanded that the Macedonian authorities put an end to what it has called the persecution of Vraniskovski and his church.

                In September this year, the Serbian Orthodox Church put the head of the Macedonian Orthodox Church on trial in an ecclesiastical court for alleged secessionism, which dampened hopes of an end to the dispute between the two churches.

                The Macedonian church rebuffed the move, insisting that Serbian church has no jurisdiction in its country.

                A high-level Russian Orthodox cleric urged Macedonian leaders to free Jovan Vraniskovski, a controversial priest who is serving a jail sentence for embezzlement.

                Comment

                • Big Bad Sven
                  Senior Member
                  • Jan 2009
                  • 1528

                  For all of the Serbian lovers in Macedonia and the diaspora: how does it make you feel that the people you love and worship so much don't recognize your church and are creating agents to destabilize the Macedonian orthodox church?

                  How does it make you feel that Russia will always support Serbia and never recognize the Macedonian Orthodox Church?

                  Will these Macedonians still support Serbian sports team and go to Serbian music festivals?
                  Last edited by Big Bad Sven; 12-22-2014, 09:10 PM.

                  Comment

                  • Risto the Great
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 15658

                    Originally posted by Big Bad Sven View Post
                    Will these Macedonians still support Serbian sports team and go to Serbian music festivals?
                    .......

                    Yes.
                    Risto the Great
                    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                    Comment

                    • sydney
                      Member
                      • Sep 2008
                      • 390

                      Originally posted by Big Bad Sven View Post
                      Metropolitan Hilarion Alefeev of Volokolamsk, seen as one of the most influential figures in the Russian Orthodox Church and head of its external relations department, urged Macedonian leaders to release Vraniskovski in order to help the countrys church settle its status in the Orthodox world[/url]
                      Seems like a ridiculous statement to me, as though the release of Jovan will pave the way for the fair treatment the Macedonian Orthodox Church deserves. The negative attitudes of our dear neighbours will always plague Macedonia.

                      Comment

                      • Redsun
                        Member
                        • Jul 2013
                        • 409

                        Settle its status in the Orthodox world...

                        What does that mean?

                        I have no clue about this hierarchy, how does it work?

                        I thought the Church belonged to the people.

                        What is above the Orthodox religion's?

                        Who does the church answer to?

                        Comment

                        • George S.
                          Senior Member
                          • Aug 2009
                          • 10116

                          The answer seems to be nobody but themselves.
                          This about sizes things up " The negative attitudes of our dear neighbours will always plague Macedonia."They care about recgnition whilst the neighbours belittle us for asking for a status.
                          "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
                          GOTSE DELCEV

                          Comment

                          • Soldier of Macedon
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 13670

                            Originally posted by sydney View Post
                            Seems like a ridiculous statement to me, as though the release of Jovan will pave the way for the fair treatment the Macedonian Orthodox Church deserves. The negative attitudes of our dear neighbours will always plague Macedonia.
                            The release of that moron won't pave the way for anything, instead it will demonstrate the weakness of Macedonian institutions. Macedonia's status in the Orthodox world was the same as it was before this moron became a tool for the destructive foreign interests and irredentism against the country. And the Macedonian Orthodox Church doesn't need the 'recognition' of anybody other than the Macedonian people - something that its holy synod needs to come to terms with real quick.
                            In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                            Comment

                            • Om3n
                              Junior Member
                              • Feb 2009
                              • 46

                              Greetings... so I was browsing Facebook when I happened upon the page of the "Autonomous Archdiocese of Ohrid" which was created in January of this year. I began to look through the posts and noticed a good bulk of them are in Greek script and link to Greek sources. I thought it unusual but I didn't think much of it (the Greeks ought to show partiality to a church in communion with them despite nationality). Then I went through the photo section and saw an album titled "Macedonia". Naturally, I clicked on it, and to my astonishment what I saw did not relate to Macedonia as of the Macedonians but of Greek contrivances: there are instances of the Greek flag; one has has an image of Pavlos Melas overlaying it, another has the words MAKEDONIA ELLAS sprawled across it, and there are yet others which paint a very clear picture.

                              After seeing this I was rightfully alarmed and became very suspicious; my mind went into overdrive as I connected the proverbial dots, recalling certain information I've acquired over the years regarding this state of affairs and which culminated in my "epiphany"... I wondered whether our dear "Archbishop" Jovan here might be a plant: an agent of the Greek-Serbian Brotherhood, as it were, tasked with the subversion of the enemy Church. After all, it is ludicrous to believe (as I foolishly did) that the Constantinopolitan Patriarchate would recognise a Church exhibiting an ethnic Macedonian identity. This "archagent" Jovan (as I will henceforth refer to him) has previously renounced his Macedonian nationality, calling himself a "Roman" and catering to the Bulgarian propaganda fetishists by undermining our history. Also, on the official website of the Archagency, among the few parishes they have listed which are in honour of a saint they have the 'Chapel Saint Nektarios of Aegina'. Now, St. Nektarios is also venerated in the Macedonian Orthodox Church, but of all the saints they picked a Macedonian Struggle-era Greek?

                              Anyway, my investigation into this matter led me here and I am seemingly not the first to concoct this opinion. Thus I thought it pertinent to share this information. The photos themselves can be viewed here: https://www.facebook.com/Autonomous-...=page_internal

                              Peace.

                              Comment

                              • Soldier of Macedon
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2008
                                • 13670

                                Hi Om3n, welcome to the forum.
                                Originally posted by Om3n View Post
                                .....the Greeks ought to show partiality to a church in communion with them despite nationality.....
                                They were misled long ago and their delusion is now part of their national character. In more recent times, this can be traced back to when some supposed religious "elites" who spoke Greek (i.e., Romaic) started to hijack Orthodox Christianity by injecting their own so-called 'ethnic' self-puffery into a common religion. To be honest, I couldn't care less about their partiality or our essentially inconsequential commonality. Each to their own. Orthodox unity will remain a pipe dream so long as certain groups place their national hatred of other Orthodox peoples above their religion.
                                .....there are instances of the Greek flag; one has has an image of Pavlos Melas........
                                Pavlos Melas, a French-born Epirote who wasn't even from Macedonia and who wrote letters to his wife where he clearly acknowledged the existence of the local language which he himself referred to as Macedonian.
                                I wondered whether our dear "Archbishop" Jovan here might be a plant: an agent of the Greek-Serbian Brotherhood.......
                                No doubt he is a pawn of that moronic "brotherhood". Throughout history, Macedonia has been cursed by treachery from within. Yet, we're still here.
                                In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                                Comment

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