Albanian view of Ottoman era

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  • Onur
    Senior Member
    • Apr 2010
    • 2389

    Albanian view of Ottoman era

    Albanians Question ‘Negative’ View of Ottomans
    Aggressive invader or friendly administration? The portrayal of the Ottoman Empire in Albania’s history books remains the subject of fierce debate for Albanians and Turks alike.

    Extracts: The History of the Albanian People*
    “The struggle against the national yoke of the Ottomans to create an independent state, which has been the fundamental intention of the National Liberation Movement was, in itself, a democratic measure. The fulfillment of such objective would pave the way for the country’s economic and cultural development."

    "Furthermore, the National Movement was directed towards a specific social class, against the semi-feudal, Turkic-Ottoman one (with the Sultan at its head),which had the political power and oppressed and kept the Albanians, and other non-Turkish nations, under its yoke.”

    “Albania was ruled by a medieval and despotic invader, with the ugliest features of economic and political violence, like heavy taxation, political discrimination that led to the denial of identity of the Albanian nation, the barring of teaching in the native tongue in schools, the absence of most elementary human rights, and even the massacring of the Albanian population through punitive expeditions.”

    “The diffusion of national culture and education would help in the emancipation of the Albanian nation from fanaticism, backwardness, intolerance and religious divisions, which had been planted by the Ottoman rulers.”

    * Fragments retrieved from The History of the Albanian People, published by the Albanian Academy of Sciences, 2002, Vol II


    When Dorina Zhupa decided to take advantage of free Turkish language classes in the Albanian capital Tirana, she found herself on the receiving end of a history lesson she had not bargain for at all. While the 27-year-old expected to spend the lesson practising her Turkish, she was surprised to discover that Albania had never been a subject state of the Ottoman Empire. The Ottomans were not so much invader as friendly administrator, the professor declared.

    “We were discussing Albanian history in the class and, at some point I said that Albania was freed from Turkish occupation in 1912. However, Professor Derjaj corrected me immediately by saying that, indeed, the Ottoman Empire administered Albania and had not occupied it,” says Zhupa.

    “I think that living together with the Ottomans was welcomed by Albanians. If we analyse the language and customs of Albanians today, we can see that Albanians and Turks lived together and Turks were welcomed.”

    The Ottoman Grand Viziers acted as de facto prime ministers and effectively run the empire. They came second only to the Sultan himself. However, like most Albanians, Zhupa learned little about these Albanian-born viziers. Instead, she was taught that the Ottomans invaded Albania and occupied the country by force for five centuries until the 1912-1913 Balkans War.

    As was the case with other nations in the Balkans, not only is the Ottoman presence in Albania seen as an invasion, it is widely regarded as a national tragedy. The Ottomans are still blamed for arresting Albania’s development to such an extent that Albanians still suffer the consequences today. To be told the Ottomans were friendly administrators came as something of a shock to Zhupa.


    Nascent nationalism
    While Derjaj’s views may be controversial for Albanians, he is certainly not alone in questioning whether Ottoman rule in Albania was an occupation by force. Many historians now believe that, in the wake of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire in Europe, Albania’s new leaders and nation-builders set about deliberately constructing a new, unifying western identity that cast the Ottoman past as a tragic accident.

    Similarly the official histories of other Balkan states, notably Bulgaria and Serbia, describe their past in terms of a centuries-long fight to liberate themselves from their Ottoman yoke. However, while such predominantly Christian countries could portray their history in such terms with relative ease, the issue among Muslim-majority Albanians was more complex.

    In an attempt to unify and strengthen the newly-independent Albania, the political elites downplayed religious differences, choosing instead to focus on cutting links with the Ottoman past.

    Turkish words were purged from the Albanian language and those Albanian-born grand viziers who ruled the Ottoman Empire are not even mentioned in the country’s official historical records.

    That official version, recently republished by the Academy of Sciences of Albania, state that the political leaders of the new Albania believed that subjugating individual identities in favour of a national consciousness and education would “help in the emancipation of the Albanian nation from fanaticism, backwardness, intolerance and religious divisions, which had been planted by the Ottoman rulers”.

    This new, post-Ottoman and purposely western identity was forged at the expense of historical accuracy, argue some historians, as these new leaders – some of whom were former Ottoman Empire officials - sought to falsely emphasise Albanian resistance against their Ottoman oppressors.

    “Creating a western identity was a matter of survival for Albanian elites in the late 19 century,” explains Tirana-based sociologist Enis Sulstarova. “The kind of history that portrays Turks simply as enemies of Albanians begun in the late 19th century as part of the Albanian nation-building process known as the ‘national revival’… this practice of nationalistic history-telling continued under communism and continues today. “Today, the legacy of Ottoman Empire is considered in Albania as responsible for almost every economic, cultural or political issue that the country encounters. This is a banal historicism where many people find it easier to blame today’s problems on the Turks. Some say that if we were not invaded by the Ottomans (referred to simply as Turks in Albania), we would be a developed western nation today.”


    Propaganda
    Historians generally agree that Albanian historical records were influenced by nationalistic propaganda during the ‘national revival’ of the 19th century and the communist regime during the second half of 20th century.

    Ferid Duka, a historian and Ottoman era specialist at the European University of Tirana, says: “Albanian history under communism portrayed the Ottoman period in an extremely negative way by unreasonably emphasising… underdevelopment, subjugation and the violence used by the Ottomans and by defining that period simply by the popular uprising against the Ottoman rule. “This point of view also dominated the historiography of other countries in the Balkans, but to a lesser extent. The main reason for this kind of history was simply that the official ideology of the communism dictated that any reality created by foreign rule must always be considered as dark and hated.”

    Indeed, the historical records of many Balkan states have been strongly criticised as unbalanced and containing highly prejudicial portrayals of the Ottomans and neighbouring states. So much so, the Balkan Trust for Democracy appointed a group of 60 historians from 11 southeast European countries to revise regional history books.

    In September this year, the group produced four new books to be used by history teachers across the Balkans.
    “The new workbooks… do not offer a new, single ‘truth’ about past controversies, but provide a variety of information and sources through comments, documents, letters and pictures,” says historian Dubravka Stojanovic, the editor of the Serbian history books.

    Some historians believe that people in the Balkans, after a period of prolonged and often difficult nation-building, are now ready to view the Ottoman era with less antagonism.

    Dritan Egro, an Ottoman era historian at Albania’s Institute of History, says this “softening” towards the Ottomans is a result of a more sophisticated approach to social sciences combined with a renewed, general curiosity about the period

    “After the creation and solidification of nation states in the Balkans, that needed… [historical accounts portraying] the Ottoman Empire as subjecting its peoples to 500 years of darkness and a choking oppression… [has developed into] a curiosity about what really happened during the Ottoman Empire,” says Egro.

    Yet, revising historical accounts is still seen as an attack on Albanian’s national identity by some. Others have mixed feelings with regard to renewed ties with the Turks.

    03 Dec 2010

    Gjergj Erebara, Tirana, Albania

    http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti...ew-of-ottomans


    This article really surprised me cuz i had no idea about the Albanians negative point of view about Ottoman era in their history books for children. Especially the excerpts from the publication by the Albanian Academy of Science is really absurd!

    Oppressed Albanians? Heavy taxation? Massacring Albanians??? I mean, WTF is that? When Turks oppressed and massacred Albanians. "barring of teaching in the native tongue in schools" LOL? The very first document in Albanian language was from 17th century and they say Turks forbid them learning their own language!!! They cant provide a single proof for that but it`s ridicules to claim that!!! Albania always ruled by Albanian viziers themselves in Ottoman era and obviously there was no such a thing as forbidding Albanian language.

    I can even say that Albanians lived in much better conditions than Turks of Anatolia in Ottoman era cuz there was both ethnic and religious tensions in Anatolia in the last decades of Ottoman Empire but Albania had none of these problems. While millions of Turkish people died in that time, Albanians was enjoying their privileged conditions in Macedonia and ruling in Albania however they like.

    It`s very funny to read that they blame Turks for their backwardness instead of blaming communist era. They should look to the situation of Japan now after two catastrophic atomic bombs in late 1945. Still blaming us after 100 years is stupid. Who believes that crap?

    I also wonder what they teach in history classes if they totally erased Ottoman era. Maybe few sentences of their Illyrian myth? How they can even write an history book of Albania without properly mentioning Ottoman era? At least philhellenes of western Europe produced more than enough fantasy to teach Greek children but Albanians doesn't have that privilege either. I just pity for them...cuz there was dozens of Albanian grand viziers who ruled in all over the Balkans and middle-east from Tirana to Egypt. It`s their loss if they totally wiped out their own people`s history, not ours.
    Last edited by Onur; 02-15-2011, 04:55 PM.
  • Ottoman
    Banned
    • Nov 2010
    • 203

    #2
    Screw those Albanian dicks man, the Ottoman Empire was in every aspect far ahead of Europe at the time, I bet those Albanian bitches wouldnt like to live in medieval Europe were people were tortured for fun because someone got bored!!

    Comment

    • Onur
      Senior Member
      • Apr 2010
      • 2389

      #3
      Ottoman rule was far from perfect but which rule was perfect in medieval era? I also believe that Ottoman rule was better than most of European states at that time. At least we didn't burn people alive on crucifixes, just because of religious difference, while in western Europe, it was the exact opposite.

      I know most of you guys will disagree with me about that but i would like to see one thing in the history books of Balkan countries. I certainly believe that if there would be no Turkish rule around here, catholics would surely kill all of the muslims(Albanians) and orthodox people since they had already declared that orthodoxy is heresy. You know, there was one and only punishment for heretics `till 16th century; burning alive on a cross! Catholics would surely do that since they already established their rule around here after crusades. They would surely destroy Byzantine Empire and orthodoxy, all together if Turks wouldn't get these lands as early as 14th century.

      Hard to swallow for them but even Greek church should accept that cuz if there would be no Turks, they would surely face with the same fate as Bogomils, Gnostics etc.

      Comment

      • makedonche
        Senior Member
        • Oct 2008
        • 3242

        #4
        Onur
        Interesting article, the one thing that stands out to me is the obvious methodology used in it's compilation, it appears they attended the Greek school of historical interpretations, befor they wrote this.
        On Delchev's sarcophagus you can read the following inscription: "We swear the future generations to bury these sacred bones in the capital of Independent Macedonia. August 1923 Illinden"

        Comment

        • Soldier of Macedon
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 13670

          #5
          I would like to get the Albanian perspective from someone like Epirot on when the Albanian struggle for national independence from the Turks began, post-Skenderbeg days.
          In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

          Comment

          • Big Bad Sven
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2009
            • 1528

            #6
            "Enis Sulstarova" - nice sounding "slavic" name we have here, or perhaps it is ancient Illyrian or Pelasgian

            Comment

            • Serdarot
              Member
              • Feb 2010
              • 605

              #7
              well, i have small objection...

              Many (i guess more than half) of the Grand Viziers were from the Balkans, but i have serious doubts most of them being albanians...

              big part of the albanians are NOT from the Balkans, and that is only ONE of the reasons

              The Wolfs and the Lions are not hanging out with hienas, simply as that
              Last edited by Serdarot; 02-15-2011, 11:48 PM.
              Bratot:
              Никој не е вечен, а каузава не е нова само е адаптирана на новите услови и ќе се пренесува и понатаму.

              Comment

              • Prolet
                Senior Member
                • Sep 2009
                • 5241

                #8
                Onur, Albania is in political strife as the Ghegs and the Tosks can no longer live together, just recently they had a punch up in their parliament. The Ghegs who are in Macedonia and Kosovo aswell as Northern Albania want everything to be done their way as we saw on the whole Kale saga, all you need to do is ask the Turkish people in Macedonia and they will give you the exact answer. They say that the Kale is Albanian Land, the Ottoman Turks done so much more for it and never once did they complain.

                If the Albanians in Macedonia only had just a little bit of that Turkish respect towards our country we wouldnt be in this mess, all we hear from them is ridicules demands, blackmail,threats of force,riots and so forth. No Turkish Citizen would put up with this in Turkey.
                МАКЕДОНЕЦ си кога кавал ќе ти ја распара душата,зурла ќе ти го раскине срцето,кога секое влакно од кожата ќе ти се наежи кога ќе видиш шеснаесеткрако сонце,кога до коска ќе те заболи кога ќе слушнеш ПЈРМ,кога немаш ни за леб,а полн си во душата затоа што ја сакаш МАКЕДОНИЈА. МАКЕДОНИЈА во срце те носиме.

                Comment

                • Risto the Great
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 15658

                  #9
                  Onur, you have stated the Albanians were in fact very well catered for by the Ottomans. Can you distinguish between the treatment of Albanians as against Macedonians by the Ottomans?
                  Risto the Great
                  MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                  "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                  Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                  Comment

                  • Ottoman
                    Banned
                    • Nov 2010
                    • 203

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Onur View Post
                    Ottoman rule was far from perfect but which rule was perfect in medieval era? I also believe that Ottoman rule was better than most of European states at that time. At least we didn't burn people alive on crucifixes, just because of religious difference, while in western Europe, it was the exact opposite.

                    I know most of you guys will disagree with me about that but i would like to see one thing in the history books of Balkan countries. I certainly believe that if there would be no Turkish rule around here, catholics would surely kill all of the muslims(Albanians) and orthodox people since they had already declared that orthodoxy is heresy. You know, there was one and only punishment for heretics `till 16th century; burning alive on a cross! Catholics would surely do that since they already established their rule around here after crusades. They would surely destroy Byzantine Empire and orthodoxy, all together if Turks wouldn't get these lands as early as 14th century.

                    Hard to swallow for them but even Greek church should accept that cuz if there would be no Turks, they would surely face with the same fate as Bogomils, Gnostics etc.
                    If Im not mistaken there was a crusade against the Byzantine Empire, the Seljuqs were on the crusaders side then, or am I incorrect?

                    Comment

                    • Onur
                      Senior Member
                      • Apr 2010
                      • 2389

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Ottoman View Post
                      If Im not mistaken there was a crusade against the Byzantine Empire, the Seljuqs were on the crusaders side then, or am I incorrect?
                      You are mistaken.

                      Turks never cooperated with crusaders in any case. It`s something impossible cuz crusaders even ate(literally) Seljuk Turks in today`s borders of Turkey and Syria. Byzantines called crusaders for help first but after short time even they have regretted cuz they were thinking that crusaders would beat Turks and give back Anatolia to them but crusaders didn't do that and occupied Anatolia and then middle-east for themselves, for their Latin empire and Pope.

                      When crusaders invaded Istanbul, Byzantine emperor and his 100s of followers seek refuge in Seljuk court and after few decades, Byzantine emperor was able to go back to Istanbul and beat crusaders with the help of Seljuks.

                      Only Mongols of Ghengis Khan allied with crusaders against Turks(Seljuks and Mamelukes).

                      Comment

                      • Ottoman
                        Banned
                        • Nov 2010
                        • 203

                        #12
                        Ok I remember now, it were the Byzantines and Seljuqs teaming up against the crusaders, thank you Onur.

                        I red this somehwere, I did know that one of the crusades was against the Byzantines.

                        Comment

                        • Epirot
                          Member
                          • Mar 2010
                          • 399

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
                          I would like to get the Albanian perspective from someone like Epirot on when the Albanian struggle for national independence from the Turks began, post-Skenderbeg days.
                          Hi SoM

                          Long time no see...most of time I am 'condemned' to be busy because of my job in library! If I understood correctly your question about when the Albanian struggle for national independence began, I would say for the Ali Pasha's period. But in Albanian historical books, which were influenced from Marxist thought it was said that conscious struggle for independence rose up especially after social revolts against 'Tanzimat' reforms. I object that because it ignore Ali Pasha's struggle to create an Albanian state which would include most of lands peopled by Albanians (from Montenegro up to the Peleoponnesus). In the program of Ali Pasha for common struggle (with the Orthodoxes of 'Greece') it was elaborated the idea to create an autonomous "Greek" state under Albanian protectorate. If Ali Pasha's plan would be successful, I bet that no one today will heard about "Greek" state and nation...
                          IF OUR CHRONICLES DO NOT LIE, WE CALL OURSELVES AS EPIROTES!

                          Comment

                          • Onur
                            Senior Member
                            • Apr 2010
                            • 2389

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Epirot View Post
                            If Ali Pasha's plan would be successful, I bet that no one today will heard about "Greek" state and nation...
                            All these are just theories but i think it would be exact opposite of what you said. So, I bet if Ali pasha would be successful, then there would be no Albania and no Albanians today and you all would be Hellenes of Epirus and you Epirot would discuss about how you are the direct descendants of ancient Greeks of Epirus like your Arvanite kinsmen does in Greece today.

                            Btw what`s your opinion about the "The History of the Albanian People, published by the Albanian Academy of Sciences, 2002"??? You think Turks massacred you, abandoned your language????




                            Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                            Onur, you have stated the Albanians were in fact very well catered for by the Ottomans. Can you distinguish between the treatment of Albanians as against Macedonians by the Ottomans?
                            Albanians was the second behind Bosnians in terms of most privileged subjects in Ottoman Empire. Beside Turkish ones, the number of Bosnian viziers was highest and second was Albanians. Like all the other medieval empires, Ottoman Empire was based on religious rules too but ofc there was religious tolerance and harmony in there unlike other states in Europe. But ofc, a non-muslim didn't have a chance to be an officer of any kind in administration. Non-muslim could only work in private sectors like commerce or agriculture. Muslims was paying 2/3 or half of the taxes paid by non-muslims. Also non-muslim had no right to carry fire weapons.

                            None of these was problem for Albanians since most of them was muslims like today. After 1878, Ottoman empire went bankrupt and Albanians(bashibozuks) gained full authority in Macedonia and Albania. Albanian bashibozuks was the only security force in there and they were running wild `till 1912. Already thats why they called as "bashibozuk" by the Turks, meaning free headed, orderless people who doesn't listen anything. After Young Turks revolution, new rulers of Ottoman Empire agreed with Sandanski for autonomous Macedonian state which includes all parts of geographical Macedonia and by the request of Sandanski, Young Turks abolished the bashibozuks and forbid them to carry any fire weapon since their abusive actions was very well known for everyone. Just a day after this declaration, Albanians refused to hand on their weapons, then Young Turks threatened them to send an army from Istanbul to Macedonia and then bashibozuks ran away to current Albania territories and started their uprising against Turks in 1912 and declared their independent Albanian state.

                            This story of Albanian uprising is very well documented by every historian and in the memoirs of officers in 1912. I`ve read many books about that.
                            Last edited by Onur; 02-16-2011, 11:04 AM.

                            Comment

                            • Epirot
                              Member
                              • Mar 2010
                              • 399

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Onur View Post
                              All these are just theories but i think it would be exact opposite of what you said. So, I bet if Ali pasha would be successful, then there would be no Albania and no Albanians today and you all would be Hellenes of Epirus and you Epirot would discuss about how you are the direct descendants of ancient Greeks of Epirus like your Arvanite kinsmen does in Greece today.
                              You are just assuming, mate! Ali Pasha never felt himself related to the Greeks (for the simple reason that there were no Greeks at the time) or to Greece (again for the simple reason that there was no Greece at the time). Furthermore, Ali Pasha celebrated a historical memory that consider himself as a descendant of Scanderbeg. I highly doubt that Albanians would be Hellenized when we keep in mind fact that Ali Pasha and the nucleus of his semi-independent state were "Muslim" Albanians who have no clue what is Hellenism or Hellenic culture.
                              Albanians had chance to be "Greeks" or to declare their country as "Greece" but instead they declared proudly themselves as ALBANIANS (both Muslims and Orthodoxes).

                              Btw what`s your opinion about the "The History of the Albanian People, published by the Albanian Academy of Sciences, 2002"??? You think Turks massacred you, abandoned your language????
                              It would be quite incorrect to say "Turks" (at the context we are talking about) because the best expression that fits to that period is "Ottoman" or "Ottomanism" (or in the context "Ottomans..."). Of course, Ottoman troops made hostile represails against everyone who joined anti-Ottoman revolts and this is well-documented. It is very meaningless to doubt or even worst, to review this reality.
                              Ottoman empire even after Young Turk "revolution" fought against Albanian schools. Young-Turks tolerated only Greek schools...so Greece owe its success in hellenization of southern Albanians to the Ottoman Empire...
                              IF OUR CHRONICLES DO NOT LIE, WE CALL OURSELVES AS EPIROTES!

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