Originally posted by Louis
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The socio-cultural roots of the greek economic crisis
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The article is highly emotive, but it really paints the reality of modern Greece. Quite a few of the points appear as parallels in Macedonia and other parts of the Balkans today. I'm talking about the way we missed out on the Renaissance, and that until recently, our cultural and economic development had been quite limited.
It seems to me that Greece was only artificially modernised on the surface since independence. The underlying simplistic mindsets of their people kept their economy and professional culture limited. This damage continued to occur because there was a huge sum of EU funds to irresponsibly borrow from while they continued their charade of being modern europeans with a glorious ancient past.
Macedonia did not have the same benefit/curse of crazy EU handouts. I'm getting the feeling that the natural order of civilization is occuring in Macedonia and it's only because the Macedonians have not had the same catalysts to perpetuate the negative aspects of our Balkan traits. With time, it seems that these negative traits are being stamped out much quicker than in Greece, where the traits have been nurtured and even enhanced in the past 200 years. Their reality check will hit them like a ton of bricks.- Секој чоек и нација има можност да успеат колку шо си дозволуваат. Нема изговор.
- Every human and nation has the ability to be as great or as weak as they allow themselves to be. No excuses.
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Originally posted by George S. View PostSo you did enter turkey or were you prevented.? how was it?How was ephesus.?Did it meet your expectations??Turkey is pretty popular with tourists.Did you end up in Izmir?If so how was it as a tourist destination?
Your friend Onur tried to warn Turkish authorities about me..funny thing is I have friends in Turkey.
Hey Onur, try entering Bulgaria again.
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Thanks for the article Onur.
There are other, interesting articles on that site (in Greek) as well.
Οι Αρβανίτες απόκτησαν ελληνική συνείδηση - YouTube
What exactly is Greek national conscience is clear from the above excerpt from the feature productions Sky, "1821" (although this was not the intention of the director) and his debate with presenter Associate Professor, University of Athens, Mr. M. Efthymiou.
In this excerpt, which have dramatizations of the besieged preparations for the impending exit of Messolonghi, a mother sings to her child a lullaby in a non-Greek language (obviously Arvanitika or Vlach).
Efthymiou "highlights" and "clarifies" the fact that in Messollongi Arvanites fought with "Greek national consciousness" and felt "more Greek than the Greeks"; and acquired "the feeling that I am the descendant of the ancient Greeks."
Therefore: Greek national consciousness is the Illusion of multiethnic Romioi descending from the ancient Greeks.Last edited by Carlin; 08-25-2012, 10:19 PM.
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[QUOTE=Carlin;133043]Thanks for the article Onur.
There are other, interesting articles on that site (in Greek) as well.
Οι Αρβανίτες απόκτησαν ελληνική συνείδηση - YouTube
What exactly is Greek national conscience is clear from the above excerpt from the feature productions Sky, "1821" (although this was not the intention of the director) and his debate with presenter Associate Professor, University of Athens, Mr. M. Efthymiou.
In this excerpt, which have dramatizations of the besieged preparations for the impending exit of Messolonghi, a mother sings to her child a lullaby in a non-Greek language (obviously Arvanitika or Vlach).
Efthymiou "highlights" and "clarifies" the fact that in Messollongi Arvanites fought with "Greek national consciousness" and felt "more Greek than the Greeks"; and acquired "the feeling that I am the descendant of the ancient Greeks."
Therefore: Greek national consciousness is the Illusion of multiethnic Romioi descending from the ancient Greeks.[/Q
What the hell is modern Turkey?
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one of my friends at work said that probably about a 1/3of turkey is greek people."Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
GOTSE DELCEV
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That same 'friend' probably believes Macedonians are 'Greek'. If you don't believe such garbage yourself, don't post such comments for nothing. It does nothing but waste forum space. Try adding some more depth to your posts rather than just making quick and irrelevant remarks George, you have over 6,000 posts on this forum now and a large share of them are these sort of comments.In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.
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Originally posted by George S. View Postone of my friends at work said that probably about a 1/3of turkey is greek people.
If anyone would like to consult a source, look no further than Ostrogorsky who states that by 10th/11th century AD Slavs comprised a great proportion of inhabitants of Asia Minor. It was a multi-ethnic region peopled by: Slavs, Arabs, Armenians, Georgians, Persians, and others.
Let's not forget the episode of the Revolt by Thomas the Slav in the 9th century. He was a 9th century Byzantine military commander of Slavic origin - a native of Asia Minor. (Wikipedia: Genesios and other chroniclers state that Thomas also won the support of "Hagarenes, Indians, Egyptians, Assyrians, Medians, Abasgians, Zichs, Iberians, Kabirs, Slavs, Huns, Vandals, Getae, the sectarians of Manes, Laz, Alanians, Chaldians, Armenians and every kind of other peoples".)
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Originally posted by damian View PostEfthymiou "highlights" and "clarifies" the fact that in Messollongi Arvanites fought with "Greek national consciousness" and felt "more Greek than the Greeks"; and acquired "the feeling that I am the descendant of the ancient Greeks."
Originally posted by damian View PostTherefore: Greek national consciousness is the Illusion of multiethnic Romioi descending from the ancient Greeks.
Originally posted by George S. View Postone of my friends at work said that probably about a 1/3of turkey is greek people.Last edited by Louis; 08-26-2012, 11:29 AM.
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There are no Greeks in Asia Minor never have been. They are Anatolians who took part in the liturgy of the Greek Orthodox Church they couldnt even speak greek when population exchanges occured. We have to back before the modern state and its homogenizing tendencies to understand real phenomenon.Last edited by momce; 02-14-2013, 01:29 AM.
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Originally posted by momce View PostThere are no Greeks in Asia Minor never have been. They are Anatolians who took part in the liturgy of the Greek Orthodox Church they couldnt even speak greek when population exchanges occured. We have to back before the modern state and its homogenizing tendencies to understand real phenomenon.
Mind you, not even the Turks do question this fact-the Turkish word Yunan means Ionian(Ionia=coasts of Asia Minor). Moreover, I dont think that the Turks consider themselves indigenous in Asia Minor. You cannot just delete greek presence from everywhere.
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Ionian settlements are not necessarily "greek". Greek specifically develops below Thessaly, in Attica and the Peloponnese, and then only as a rough nomenclature not as a contiguous political state(in loose federations etc which are being built and dissolved all the time, see internal Greek wars, "HellenicWar" against Macedonia post-Alexander etc). Its only with the development of the "koine" and Orthodox Christianity that these regions are erroneously considered part of Greece. Look read Pausanias he clearly delineates what is considered "Greece". And Anatolians are so far removed from Ionia that they cannot be considered "Greek".Last edited by momce; 02-16-2013, 12:07 PM.
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[QUOTE=Louis;133104
I’ve no idea who makes this conclusion (I guess it’s you) but it’s totally wrong. Arvanites (for instance) were (to some degree) Hellenized but unity came mostly through the Church. For instance, there was no such unity with the Greek Catholics who remained reserved until almost the end of Revolution.
[/QUOTE]
.......
I agree
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Originally posted by fatso View PostOnur should be more concerned about the Kurds. He ejaculates every time he posts something negative about Greece.
This rodent was to scared to sit and have a beer with me, yet he warned the Turkish authorities about me entering Turkey.
Nice try you puke, I ended up going to Ephesus.
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