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Old 02-14-2017, 06:02 PM   #11
Stefan of Pelagonia
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Originally Posted by maco2envy View Post
Also I've heard now and then that the Macedonian language is the most unintelligible out of all the slavic languages of the Balkans when spoken to Poles/Russians or any non-Balkan slavic speakers.

Can anyone confirm if this is true? Or does it narrow down to regional dialects?
The most distant languages in the Slavic branch are Polish and Macedonian.
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Old 02-14-2017, 08:20 PM   #12
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Put a Russian or a Pole next to a Macedonian. You don't have to be an expert to see that we have nothing in common.
Macedonians are a mediterranean people of Brygian stock.
Macedonians are indeed a Mediterranean people, and all evidence supports this thesis.

The problem is convincing the rest of the world about the veracity of this thesis. Even Borza, who supports the distinctness of the ancient Macedonians, believes that modern day Macedonians first arrived in the Balkans in the 5th and 6th centuries AD.

Greeks use this argument as fodder in denying our ethnic identity and our connection to the ancient Macedonians. Western academics and the media unfortunately also use this argument against us.
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Old 03-19-2017, 11:07 PM   #13
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Old 03-19-2017, 11:32 PM   #14
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This makes sense, most South Slavs are slavs in linguistic terms only with a large amount, if not the majority, of DNA markers being attributed to pre-slavic cultures, e.g. Thracian, Illyrian, Macedonian, etc.
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Old 03-19-2017, 11:54 PM   #15
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'Cretans' and 'Montenegrins'








Crnogorci = Slavicized Keraunioi Illyriovlachs

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Old 03-20-2017, 12:05 AM   #16
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Serbian historian Tibor Zivkovic: Slavs made up 2 percent to 3 percent of the population, the rest were natives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeKUHwaW1k4
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Old 03-21-2017, 12:41 AM   #17
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Is there anything out there that explains what types of geographical regions Slavic tribes preferred to settle in? If they were as dominate and numerous as the slavic migration theory makes them out to be, you'd think they would prefer to settle in lush valleys and fertile plains rather than remote mountains.

I know the turkic tribes generally settled in plains because of their horse breeding culture.
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Old 03-26-2017, 06:56 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by maco2envy View Post
Is there anything out there that explains what types of geographical regions Slavic tribes preferred to settle in? If they were as dominate and numerous as the slavic migration theory makes them out to be, you'd think they would prefer to settle in lush valleys and fertile plains rather than remote mountains.

I know the turkic tribes generally settled in plains because of their horse breeding culture.
They were not numerous at all. They were small clans that established many little states across the balkan in which they were the ruling elite, with slavic becoming the language of administration, thus being spread to the locals, which were the absolute majority.

Balkan historians are gradually accepting this.
Some of them, not wanting to lose the claim on Macedonian land, started arguing that the ancient Macedonians were Thracians / Illyrians. Luckily archaeology and onomastics prove them wrong. The only thing they rely on being the words of a few ancient greek historians who didn't know much about, and were not interested in, ''barbarian'' nations in the first place.
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Old 04-04-2017, 05:35 AM   #19
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Atlas of world history, volume one.
Hermann Kinder and Werner Hilgemann

The Slavs (Slovene from slovo = the word), a major branch of the Indo-European family of peoples, originally lived in the Pripet Marches. The area settled by Slavs later included parts of Poland, White Russia and the Ukraine. During the early centuries the history of the Slavs was connected with that of the Germans (Goths), Huns, Alani and Turkomans, with whom the Slavs often entered into mutually fruitful relationships (=symbiosis). Pliny the elder, Tacitus and the geographer Ptolemy called them Venedi or Veneti; the Germans called them Wenden; from the 6th century Byzantine writers (Procopius and Jordanes) spoke of the Sklavenoi, placing them along the Lower Danube, but also in the eastern Alps. From 600, Slavic peoples (Abodrites, Sorbs, Veneti and Pomerani) settled east of the Elbe in the areas vacated by Germanic tribes. As with the Czechs, their historical record becomes verifiable only in the Carolingian period (805, construction by Charlemagne of the limes sorbicus = line of the easternmost Frankish trade settlements).

Grouping of Slavic tribes: t
he east Slavs (Russians later subdivided into Ukrainians, White and Great Russians), west Slavs (Pols, Pomerani, Abodrites, Sorbs, Czechs and Slovaks), and south Slavs (Slovenes, Serbs, Croats and Bulgars). The unity of the Slavic world was disrupted by Germanic colonization in the Danubian area and the Eastern Alps after the destruction the Avar kingdom, and by the migration of the Magyars to the Hungarian plain c. 900 (owing to pressure from the east by the Patzinaks): separation of the west Slavs in the north from the south Slavs.

Society: originally the Slavs lived in clans (reverence of ancestors), consisting of large familial communities. Several of these familial communities made up larger social units led by elders. These again made up the tribe with its military organization (the century as the basic unit of the levy, then the millennium) and its common religious culture. The leaders of the familial communities gradually developed into an aristocratic upper class. The particularism of the tribes prevented the establishment of any great power status for the Slavs. Titles of rulers used in later times were borrowed from other languages: kunedzi (prince) was Germanic (king); Korlji (Czech Kral) was derived from the name Charlemagne; the title of Tsar from the Roman Caesar.

Economic Life: the Slavs occupied themselves with farming, hunting, fishing, the raising of domestic animals and bee-culture in the extended areas of their settlement. There were also – predominantly living in the towns – artisans (specialist): carpenters, weavers, potters, tanners and furriers. Active trading developed along the rivers. Raw materials (honey, wax, furs) were exchanged for textiles, weapons, utensils, jewellery, gold and silver. The Jews, Germans and Greeks at first monopolized trade; the Slavs themselves did so later. The trading centres of the east Slavs became towns.

Religion: historical sources speak of names and images of gods, of the temples of the west Slavs (the temple of Arkona on the island of Rugen, the shrine of the god Triglaw at Stettin and that of Svaricic at Rethra), of tree cultures and oracles. The use of amulets and symbols indicates contacts with the Iranians and Turkomans. The east Slavs knew the God of Thunder and Lightning, Perun. The supreme deity of the ancient Slavs was Svarog, an early God of the Heavens and Thunder. The Slavs of the Havel area worshipped Dazbag (God of the Sun) and Jarovit (God of Spring). Within the familial communities the fertility gods Rod and Rozanicy were worshipped. All tribes worshiped nature.

The christianization of the Slavs began with the advance of Roman and Byzantine civilization into Eastern and Central Europe: during the 6th century missionary activity from Aquileia among the Croats; during the 8th century from Salzburg among the Slovenes. Missionary activity among the Wends, the Czechs (from Regensburg), the Abodrites and Elbe Slavs (from Verden at the Aller) was initiated during the reign of Charlemagne. The Slavs joined the Eastern Church c. 850. The Apostles of the Slavs, Cyril and Methodius, conducted missionary activity within the Greater Moravian Kingdom from 863; they later joined Rome.
864-5 Conversion of the Bulgars (1st autocephalous Eastern Church).
866 Christianization of groups of the Rus.
948 Establishment of the bishoprics of Havelberg, Brandenburg and Oldenburg.
966 Baptism of duke Miezko of Poland.
968 Establishment of the archbishopric of Magdeburg with the suffragan bishoprics of Meissen, Merseburg and Zeitz (moved to Naumburg in 1032) by Otto I (intended to bring about the conversion of the Elbe Slavs).
973 Establishment of the bishopric of Prague.
983 Suppression of Christian missionary activity during the rebellion of the Slavs (Havelberg, Brandenburg).
988 Baptism of the Varangian Prince Vladimir.
1000 Establishment of the archbishopric of Gnesen.
1001 Establishment of the archbishopric of Gran (Esztergom). With the establishment of this archbishopric the Polish and Hungarian churches freed of Germanic influence.

All Slavic states attempted to establish auto-nomous churches (autocephalous bishoporic or patriarchate). The Slavic language, based on a Macedonian Dialect, became the language of the Slavic churches and the written language of the Balkan and East Slavs With their acceptance into the community of Christian peoples, the Slavs reached a higher cultural level; the new common faith of the developing Slavic states also contributed to the fusion of the heterogeneous ethnic and cultural elements. Despite their split into Raman Catholic (west Slavs) and Greek Orthodox (East Slavs) states, both groups were part of the European civilization by virtue of their Christianity.

Last edited by Redsun; 04-04-2017 at 05:40 AM.
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Old 04-04-2017, 06:11 PM   #20
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Distribution of R1a in Europe:



http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplog...1a_Y-DNA.shtml

More haplogroups of interest:

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_I2_Y-DNA.shtml

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplog...1b_Y-DNA.shtml

Last edited by maco2envy; 04-05-2017 at 02:32 AM. Reason: addition of a few relevant links
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