Macedonian Truth Forum   

Go Back   Macedonian Truth Forum > Macedonian Truth Forum > Exposing Lies and Propaganda

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-01-2013, 06:43 PM   #1
Pelister
Senior Member
 
Pelister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,745
Pelister is on a distinguished road
Default Australian Musuem promoting Modern Greek nationalism

I have been unable to stay quiet about the current exhibition at the Australian Museum. I visited the gallery recently and took some notes. I am sad to say that here again, we have an public institution in Australia presenting a highly nationalist and mythical narrative of Alexander and the ancient Macedonians.

Alexander's legacy is less well known today than at any time, because of the times we live in. All of the ancient Greek and Roman sources are clear about the Kings of Macedonia, and the Macedonians. They were not regarded as Greeks, and did not consider themselves to be Greeks. All the information is there, and all of the sources are easily accessible. The problem is Modern Greek nationalism. Most Australians would have no idea they were reading propaganda. This is because there is a lot of truth in most of the narrative. They have most of the facts, the time line is accurate ...etc, but when it comes to the cultural identity of the Alexander and the ancient Macedonians, this is where the propaganda kicks in. The New Greeks (no natural historical or cultural connection to the ancient Greeks) have been trying to do two things, one, weave the ancient Macedonians into 'Greeks', and two, convince foreign leaders and the general public of it. Most Australians wouldn't care if they were told that they were reading a mythical narrative, created by the New Greeks in recent decades, around the goal of justifying the seizure of Macedonian territory in 1912 and 1913. They are there to see the jewellery, the pottery, the coins ...etc. As I noted, there is a large dose of truth about ancient people, places and events, but, woven into the fabric of this exhibition are the stock and standard nationalist myths of the Modern Greek State. This is by no means easy to spot, unless one is familiar with the specific myths of the State.

This is what the Australian Museum is presenting as 'history' and as 'fact' in this exhibition.

1. Alexander set out to ""liberate the Greeks in Asia Minor"
2. He was fighting "to free the former Greek cities of Asia from Persian control"
3. The Macedonians spoke "a Greek dialect"
4. The Macedonian army was comprised of "50,000 Greek Macedonian soldiers
5. Alexander modeled his Empire on 'Greek concepts of State' and on 'Greek institutions'
6. Alexander "spread Hellenism"
7. Alexander was on a "war of revenge" and the League of Corinth willingly supported it

Every point above is a historical lie and an outright fabrication. Alexander and the Macedonians were never in possession of Hellenism, and certainly did not spread it. The exhibition leaves out crucial details to gaining a more complete and more accurate understanding of Alexander and his Macedonians.

Here are some direct quotes from the exhibition.

Note I took great care in writing these down word for word, because Photos are not allowed in the exhibition.

Quote:
" In 334 BC, Alexander set out for a war of revenge against the Persians and the liberation of the Greeks in Asia Minor. He took with him almost 50,000 Greek Macedonians soldiers and mercenaries plus historians, botanists, geographers and engineers."
Quote:
"Liberation of Asia Minor 334-333 BC [Title heading] Alexanders first task was to free the former Greek cities of Asia from Persian control."
Quote:
"Conquest of Syria 333-332 BC [Title heading] After Issus (Battle of Issus), Alexander was no longer liberating Greeks but invading parts of the Persian Empire."
Quote:
"Battle Snapshot [Title] Battle of Issus - Persian dead: 110,000 (Diodorus, Curtius, Plutarch, Arrian or 71,000 and 40,000 persons (Justin)"
Quote:
"The invasion of Persia 331-330 BC [Title] Alexander left Persopolis and headed north to Ecbatana ... While there, he dismissed his troops from the Greek city states. Although many re-enlisted as mercenaries, this ended the League's official involvement in the campaign."
Quote:
"Burning of Persopolis palace, May 330 BC [Title] The capture of Persopolis ... marked the end of the 'war of vengeance'."
Quote:
"Battle Snapshot [Title] Battle of Gaugamela, 1 October 331. Persian dead: 300,000 (Arrian); 90,000 (Diordorus), 40,000 (Curtius)"
Quote:
"East of India 327-326 BC [Title] In the summer of 327 BC, Alexander led his army yet into the wilds of India and modern Pakistan. These places inspired him. To the Greeks, they were the end of the world and filled with curiosities and strange beasts."
Quote:
"Alexander's legacy [Title] Alexander's campaign created an empire through which all things Greeks spread - from religions, science and government to language, art and architecture. This era which lasted about 3000 years would later be called the Hellenistic period."
Quote:
"A common language [Title] With Greeks Kings, officials and settlers and trades, it was inevitable that Greek became the empires 'official language'. However, languages evolve. This Greek was not one of the ancient dialects but a new from called koine or 'common' Greek that probably arose as a shared tongue of Alexanders diverse army. Many old dialects, including the Macedonians, disappeared during this period."
Quote:
"Government under kings [Title] Alexander left behind an empire initially under a single ruler. Many provinces had officials to represent the king, but also had a degree of political independence. Institutions were modeled on Greek democratic principles and included councils, assemblies and magistrates. This remained the model of government throughout the Hellenistic period, long after Alexander's death. ... Greeks occupied most official positions."
Quote:
"Greek institutions such as temples, theaters, gymnasiums ... were erected."
Editors note: One of the features of this narrative is how ancient institutions are represented as exclusively 'Greek', suggesting no one could have them or used them, and that these were borrowed from the Greeks.

Quote:
"Alexander in the East [Title] In some regions of the far east, Alexanders legend is poor. These are the regions where his brutality was worst and the Hellenistic influence weakest."
Every quote here is either an outright historical fabrication for which there is no evidence, and are in fact contradicted by the ancient sources; or a distortion of the true history of Alexander, his conquest and his Macedonians.

The true history of this individual and his men is that he hated the Greeks. He cut them down every opportunity he got where ever he found them. The evidence is clear about it. He cut down whole communities of Greeks, specifically colonies in Asia, whether they gave provocation or not. His reason for doing it was that they were Greeks. It is also a FACT of history that the ancient Greeks resisted Alexander and his Macedonians every step of the way. When the Greeks were conquered, destroyed, cities sacked, hundreds of thousands sold into slavery ... etc, the Greeks joined all the foreign Kings and the foreign armies fighting against Alexander. These simple facts are entirely missing in this nationalist exhibition. There is not a single piece of historical evidence that the Macedonians spoke 'a Greek dialect'. This is a modern myth. Thirdly, Alexander modeled his Empire on Macedonian leadership and Persian concepts and institutions (not Greek ones). Fourthly, Alexander has a small contingent of Greek troops in his army he expressly considers a foreign contingent, he compares it to his other foreign contingents (Illyrian, Thracian), but he dismisses all of them before his Persian campaign. Alexander treated all Greeks differently. He would not allow Callisthenes (Aristotle's nephew) to stand before the Macedonian court, because Alexander did not consider him to be a Macedonian, he was a Greek. Representing Alexander and his Macedonians, including countless ancient artifacts as being 'Greeks' by 'influence' or in some other way is a shameful ploy to distort history. It does not do the Macedonian justice or the artifacts themselves. This is just another example of the Modern Greek State using its power and influence, indirectly, to push its nationalist agenda in Australia, and the Australian Museum and its management (who will all eventually be named), are actively promoting the nationalist mantra of a State with a history of aggressive hostility to an innocent and inoffensive Macedonian people.

Note also that at the end of the exhibition, just outside the exit doors there is a plaque with a list of individuals and organizations endorsing the narrative of the exhibition including a number of Australian academics and including the Macedonian embassy in Canberra, which is given the shameful and degrading title of Embassy of FYROM.

I think that the Museum and specifically the individuals behind this exhibition should be alerted that their names are not inextricably tied to promoting an entirely fabricated and mythical as well as nationalist presenting of ancient history.

Last edited by Pelister; 03-01-2013 at 06:51 PM.
Pelister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2013, 06:47 PM   #2
Volk
Member
 
Volk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 894
Volk is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelister View Post
I have been unable to stay quiet about the current exhibition at the Australian Museum. I visited the gallery recently and took some notes. I am sad to say that here again, we have an public institution in Australia presenting a highly nationalist and mythical narrative of Alexander and the ancient Macedonians.

Alexander's legacy is less well known today than at any time, because of the times we live in. All of the ancient Greek and Roman sources are clear about the Kings of Macedonia, and the Macedonians. They were not regarded as Greeks, and did not consider themselves to be Greeks. All the information is there, and all of the sources are easily accessible. The problem is Modern Greek nationalism. Most Australians would have no idea they were reading propaganda. This is because there is a lot of truth in most of the narrative. They have most of the facts, the time line is accurate ...etc, but when it comes to the cultural identity of the Alexander and the ancient Macedonians, this is where the propaganda kicks in. The New Greeks (no natural historical or cultural connection to the ancient Greeks) have been trying to do two things, one, weave the ancient Macedonians into 'Greeks', and two, convince foreign leaders and the general public of it. Most Australians wouldn't care if they were told that they were reading a mythical narrative, created by the New Greeks in recent decades, around the goal of justifying the seizure of Macedonian territory in 1912 and 1913. They are there to see the jewellery, the pottery, the coins ...etc. As I noted, there is a large dose of truth about ancient people, places and events, but, woven into the fabric of this exhibition are the stock and standard nationalist myths of the Modern Greek State. This is by no means easy to spot, unless one is familiar with the specific myths of the State.

This is what the Australian Museum is presenting as 'history' and as 'fact' in this exhibition.

1. Alexander set out to ""liberate the Greeks in Asia Minor"
2. He was fighting "to free the former Greek cities of Asia from Persian control"
3. The Macedonians spoke "a Greek dialect"
4. The Macedonian army was comprised of "50,000 Greek Macedonian soldiers
5. Alexander modeled his Empire on 'Greek concepts of State' and on 'Greek institutions'
6. Alexander "spread Hellenism"
7. Alexander was on a "war of revenge" and the League of Corinth willingly supported it

Every point above is a historical lie and an outright fabrication. Alexander and the Macedonians were never in possession of Hellenism, and certainly did not spread it. The exhibition leaves out crucial details to gaining a more complete and more accurate understanding of Alexander and his Macedonians.

Here are some direct quotes.

Note I took great care in writing these down word for word, because Photos are not allowed in the exhibition.

"In 334 BC, Alexander set out for a war of revenge against the Persians and the liberation of the Greeks in Asia Minor. He took with him almost 50,000 Greek Macedonians soldiers and mercenaries plus historians, botanists, geographers and engineers."

"Liberation of Asia Minor 334-333 BC [Title heading] Alexanders first task was to free the former Greek cities of Asia from Persian control."

"Conquest of Syria 333-332 BC [Title heading] After Issus (Battle of Issus), Alexander was no longer liberating Greeks but invading parts of the Persian Empire."

"Battle Snapshot [Title] Battle of Issus - Persian dead: 110,000 (Diodorus, Curtius, Plutarch, Arrian or 71,000 and 40,000 persons (Justin)"

"The invasion of Persia 331-330 BC [Title] Alexander left Persopolis and headed north to Ecbatana ... While there, he dismissed his troops from the Greek city states. Although many re-enlisted as mercenaries, this ended the League's official involvement in the campaign."

"Burning of Persopolis palace, May 330 BC [Title] The capture of Persopolis ... marked the end of the 'war of vengeance'."

"Battle Snapshot [Title] Battle of Gaugamela, 1 October 331. Persian dead: 300,000 (Arrian); 90,000 (Diordorus), 40,000 (Curtius)"

"East of India 327-326 BC [Title] In the summer of 327 BC, Alexander led his army yet into the wilds of India and modern Pakistan. These places inspired him. To the Greeks, they were the end of the world and filled with curiosities and strange beasts."

"Alexander's legacy [Title] Alexander's campaign created an empire through which all things Greeks spread - from religions, science and government to language, art and architecture. This era which lasted about 3000 years would later be called the Hellenistic period."

"A common language [Title] With Greeks Kings, officials and settlers and trades, it was inevitable that Greek became the empires 'official language'. However, languages evolve. This Greek was not one of the ancient dialects but a new from called koine or 'common' Greek that probably arose as a shared tongue of Alexanders diverse army. Many old dialects, including the Macedonians, disappeared during this period."

"Government under kings [Title] Alexander left behind an empire initially under a single ruler. Many provinces had officials to represent the king, but also had a degree of political independence. Institutions were modeled on Greek democratic principles and included councils, assemblies and magistrates. This remained the model of government throughout the Hellenistic period, long after Alexander's death. ... Greeks occupied most official positions."

"Greek institutions such as temples, theaters, gymnasiums ... were erected."

Editors note: One of the features of this narrative is how ancient institutions are represented as exclusively 'Greek', suggesting no one could have them or used them, and that these were borrowed from the Greeks.

"Alexander in the East [Title] In some regions of the far east, Alexanders legend is poor. These are the regions where his brutality was worst and the Hellenistic influence weakest."

Every quote here is either an outright historical fabrication for which there is no evidence, and are in fact contradicted by the ancient sources; or a distortion of the true history of Alexander, his conquest and his Macedonians.

The true history of this individual and his men is that he hated the Greeks. He cut them down every opportunity he got where ever he found them. The evidence is clear about it. He cut down whole communities of Greeks, specifically colonies in Asia, whether they gave provocation or not. His reason for doing it was that they were Greeks. It is also a FACT of history that the ancient Greeks resisted Alexander and his Macedonians every step of the way. When the Greeks were conquered, destroyed, cities sacked, hundreds of thousands sold into slavery ... etc, the Greeks joined all the foreign Kings and the foreign armies fighting against Alexander. These simple facts are entirely missing in this nationalist exhibition. There is not a single piece of historical evidence that the Macedonians spoke 'a Greek dialect'. This is a modern myth. Thirdly, Alexander modeled his Empire on Macedonian leadership and Persian concepts and institutions (not Greek ones). Fourthly, Alexander has a small contingent of Greek troops in his army he expressly considers a foreign contingent, he compares it to his other foreign contingents (Illyrian, Thracian), but he dismisses all of them before his Persian campaign. Alexander treated all Greeks differently. He would not allow Callisthenes (Aristotle's nephew) to stand before the Macedonian court, because Alexander did not consider him to be a Macedonian, he was a Greek. Representing Alexander and his Macedonians, including countless ancient artifacts as being 'Greeks' by 'influence' or in some other way is a shameful ploy to distort history. It does not do the Macedonian justice or the artifacts themselves. This is just another example of the Modern Greek State using its power and influence, indirectly, to push its nationalist agenda in Australia, and the Australian Museum and its management (who will all eventually be named), are actively promoting the nationalist mantra of a State with a history of aggressive hostility to an innocent and inoffensive Macedonian people.
Pelister, did you complain on the spot? People should not stay silent but make some noise! At worse the staff and the people at the exhibition would understand what is happening
__________________
Makedonija vo Srce
Volk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2013, 06:08 PM   #3
Pelister
Senior Member
 
Pelister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,745
Pelister is on a distinguished road
Default

No, I did not complain. I am interested in finding out who narrated the exhibition. My interest in posing it here was so that the information is on the world wide web. I recognised the myths when I saw them, but they were hidden, deceptively, in the main narrative and not easily recogniseable. But for anyone interested in how the New Greeks write their own 'history' and everyone elses, for that matter, the quotes above might be of interest.
Pelister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2013, 06:05 PM   #4
Pelagon
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 112
Pelagon is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelister View Post
No, I did not complain. I am interested in finding out who narrated the exhibition. My interest in posing it here was so that the information is on the world wide web. I recognised the myths when I saw them, but they were hidden, deceptively, in the main narrative and not easily recogniseable. But for anyone interested in how the New Greeks write their own 'history' and everyone elses, for that matter, the quotes above might be of interest.
I don't know if the blame should be directed towards the Greeks for this presentation as the artefacts "come from Russia's State Hermitage" and are presented by the "Australian Museum". As I see it (and the evidence is clearly there), it is mainly others who are propagating this fiction for various political and cultural agendas. It is even much more painful when you see this type of distortion being propagated by Macedonians and Macedonian institutions.

Quote:
Alexander the Great treasures coming to Sydney

Updated March 09, 2012 21:00:25
Sorry, this video has expired
Video: Alexander's greatest to go on show (7pm TV News NSW)
Map: Sydney 2000

Ancient artefacts dating back to the time of Alexander the Great are to be brought to Australia for the first time this year.

The largest-ever exhibition to come from Russia's State Hermitage will go on display at the Australian Museum in Sydney on November 24.

The exhibition - Alexander The Great: 2000 Years Of Treasures - includes more 400 objects.

Among the prized pieces are the famous Gonzaga cameo and a polished black basalt statue of Cleopatra VII.

Alexander took over as King of Macedonia in 336 BC, before building an empire that stretched from Greece in the west to the Indus River in the east.

Some 2,000 years after his mysterious death at aged 32, Alexander is still considered one of the world's greatest conquerors.

"Alexander's conquests gave birth in East and West to an incredible synthesis of cultures and even of belief systems," director of the State Hermitage, Dr Mikhail Piotrovskjy, said.

"This synthesis ... laid the basis for the world's future development, a development which led to Christian culture in its broadest sense and even to Islamic culture."

Director of the Australian Museum Frank Howarth says the artefacts will come in three shipments, each taking over three days to reach Sydney by air, with much of the road route overseen by the police escort.

They will be accompanied on the long journey by 29 curators and conservators.

[...]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-0...bition/3879368
Thanks for this detailed report and it is good to have it available as a reference point. I read a bit of the official presentation on the net late last year about the exhibition and noticed that it was distorting the historical truth with heavy pro-Greek bias and decided that it was not worth visiting.

Last edited by Pelagon; 03-08-2013 at 06:07 PM.
Pelagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2013, 06:28 PM   #5
Pelagon
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 112
Pelagon is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelister View Post
No, I did not complain. I am interested in finding out who narrated the exhibition. My interest in posing it here was so that the information is on the world wide web. I recognised the myths when I saw them, but they were hidden, deceptively, in the main narrative and not easily recogniseable. But for anyone interested in how the New Greeks write their own 'history' and everyone elses, for that matter, the quotes above might be of interest.
Since you are a critical thinker and delve into historical studies, I think there is some info in this article that was written (and I think posted here by Mango) about two years ago in the Guardian for a Greek-sponsored "Alexander the Great Exhibition" that could/should shed some new light on the Macedonian Era and the source of the artistic style of the same period.

Although Angelina Markus (Macedonian writer/retired professor) has often asserted the same, this is the first time I saw publicly stated in the mass media the following:
Quote:
"....An exhibition of more than 500 objects, most of them never before seen outside Greece, is set to rewrite knowledge of the Macedonian civilisation that brought forth Alexander the Great the man who conquered most of the known world, from Greece to Egypt, Afghanistan and India, in the 4th century BC."....
http://m.guardian.co.uk/culture/2011...nder-the-great
Quote:
Some of the most revelatory objects in the exhibition are portrait heads. Unlike the idealised faces of classical Athens, they show furrowed brows, wrinkles and laughter lines and may transform understanding of the history of portraiture. "The Macedon of Philip II is the birthplace and birth-time of realistic portraiture," said Dr Angeliki Kottaridi, the lead curator of the exhibition and the director of excavations at Aegae.
Quote:
Among these sculpted heads will be a portrait of Philip II, with a remarkably lived-in face and crinkly eyes. And even more intriguingly, there will be a set of lifesize and lifelike terracotta heads that are, according to Kottaridi, "absolutely unique". Twenty-six were found, by Kottaridi herself, in the grave of a Macedonian queen dating from about 500BC.

Dr Susan Walker, keeper of antiquities at the Ashmolean, speculated that these remarkable objects could [be] seen as forebears of the kind of elaborate Hellenistic portraiture created in Alexandria centuries later, which in turn influenced Roman "true" portraiture.
The info above should have been widely propagated by Macedonians but, sadly and to our loss, I have not noticed anything in the mainstream media about this.

Last edited by Pelagon; 03-08-2013 at 06:33 PM.
Pelagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2013, 05:11 PM   #6
George S.
Senior Member
 
George S.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 10,121
George S. is on a distinguished road
Default

if we don't write our own history that's what happens others will write it for us.They the greks are so manipulative of anything that is macedonian.They can easily give it a greek slant.
__________________
"Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
GOTSE DELCEV
George S. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2013, 08:32 PM   #7
PRODUCTOFMACEDONIA
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 13
PRODUCTOFMACEDONIA is on a distinguished road
Default

that musuem exhibition was hijacked by the homosexuals,as far as i know they had some stupid play about alexander and they gave you free cheese and wine = wtf
PRODUCTOFMACEDONIA is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump