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Old 01-08-2010, 04:22 PM   #11
Daskalot
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You have provided very interesting information Indigen.
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Old 01-08-2010, 06:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makedonin View Post
The OS suffix on the end of the Greek words is added to the Nouns which are maculine in the Nominative case.
Now they will claim Spain and its race as Helenic. Or the spanish might claim Alexandros as Hispanic. How many Spanish names end with os

On a serious note, does anyone notice the new trend in Greece regarding the sir names? the "s" on the end is taken away. eg; Bakoyanis now is "Bakoyani" or karomanlis is sometimes printed or pronounced as "karomanli". Are they trying to sound more like Italians now? no dought they would have a reason for this, but i cant ever remember this happening before the last decade. i could be wrong.
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Old 03-17-2010, 02:21 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makedonin View Post
The OS suffix on the end of the Greek words is added to the Nouns which are maculine in the Nominative case.

It appears that it would be in Greek "o Alexandros" which makes the name Maculine.

Interestingly, the Alexander I, the grandfather of Alexander III had this coin:




On the coin we read: ALEANDRO in original ΑΛΕΑΝΔΡΟ

See more here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samekh

The character is the phonecian letter samekh, reads as sharp S similar to the German sharp S represented by ß. The pronountiation is also close to the Modern Macedonian S which is also pronouced sharper than the usual European S.

More on the pronountiation here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voicele...olar_fricative there is also sound file with the pronountiation.

So on the coin we read ALESANDRO and not the ALEXANDROS.

That opens interesting perspective.


Lets revive this thread also.


On the pronountiation -> ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ = Александров.


This fresh influx of money, and the opening up of a new commercial route from Macedon to the Greek towns of the Thracian coast, by way of the valley of the Strymon, doubtless occasioned the change in standard from Babylonic to Phoenician, which now took place in the Macedonian currency.



Cadmus, the legendary hero who came to Greece from Phoenicia and founded Thebes in Boeotia, is credited with the introduction of the Phoenician alphabet to the Greek language; in its Hellenized early form the alphabet is called Cadmeian. As Herodotus tells the story,

"The Phoenicians who came with Cadmus . . . introduced into Greece, after their settlement in the country, a number of accomplishments, of which the most important was writing, an art till then, I think, unknown to the Greeks. At first they used the same characters as all the other Phoenicians, but as time went on, and they changed their language, they also changed the shape of their letters. At that period most of the Greeks in the neighborhood were Ionians; they were taught these letters by the Phoenicians and adopted them, with a few alterations, for their own use, continuing to refer to them as the Phoenician characters—as was only right, as the Phoenicians had introduced them.[2]"


http://phoenicia.org/cadmus.html


Beside the samekh letter in ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ the letter is said to be of Phoenican origin and gave the sound W or V.

Digamma disappeared from the alphabet because the sound it notated, the voiced labial-velar approximant [w], had disappeared from the Ionic dialect and most of the others.

Digamma, like Upsilon, derives from the Phoenician letter Waw, and in its turn gave rise to the Roman letter F.

The sound /w/ existed in Mycenean Greek, as attested in Linear B and archaic Greek inscriptions using digamma. It is also confirmed by the Hittite name of Troy, Wilusa, corresponding to the Greek name *Wilion.


It has been surmised that in this dialect the sound /w/ may have changed to labiodental [v] in some environments. The F-shaped letter may have stood for the new [v] sound

The digamma survives even today as /v/ in the Modern Greek Tsakonian dialect, the only dialect not descended from ancient Koine Greek, the famous, and only, example being βάννε /'vannε/ ("lamb" for standard Greek αρνί) (cf. Cretan ϝαρήν).


So it is likely the - OV ending.


Lets go further a bit...


If this is a NON-GREEK language from early ancient writings






than the connection between that and nowadays modern Macedonian language is evident:

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Old 03-17-2010, 04:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bratot View Post
On the pronountiation -> ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ = Александров.
I don't want to sound pro Greek, but since I know some Greek (learning in progress), the above stated is not true.


ΟΥ pronouced as in YOU similar to the Romanian, Chaushesku.
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Old 03-17-2010, 04:55 PM   #15
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We are not talking about modern Greek and the diphthong rule.

We are talking about ancient alphabet adopted from the Phoenicans and the phoenican letter Y gave a W/V sound.

I'm not using this in order to relate to our modern surname suffix but it is a fact, in the same way as the samekh letter.
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Old 03-17-2010, 05:01 PM   #16
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Sorry Bratot, had to read the whole post, before I make such stupid comments.

I admit that I did not read it, but rather assumed that you relate ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΥ = Александров as a Modern construct and not related to the Phoencian Υ.

My apology again.
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Old 03-17-2010, 05:14 PM   #17
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No problem bro, it is very interesting all of this.

The usage of the Phoenican letters is undisputed in ancient linguistics and what we have to follow is their conterporary usage/meaning in that time instead of going from present time to reflect the past. It can't work upside down as the egg can't be older than the chicken (as we use to say).

If we follow the pronountiation of those Phoenican letters incorporated in the coins and other matherial evidence, we will get final product - ALESANDROF.
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Old 03-17-2010, 07:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bratot View Post
...

If we follow the pronountiation of those Phoenican letters incorporated in the coins and other matherial evidence, we will get final product - ALESANDROF.
Quote:
AlexandroY, NOT AlexandroS.

And "Phillip" is FillipoY, not PhillipoS.

Pronounced probably something like Ale(k)sandro-I or Ale(k)sandro-U, and Filipo-I or Filipo-U, where (k) were pronounced in some, and missed in some dialects.

Take in note that we have "-oV" on the end of our surnames or second names.

Petko TrajkoV FilipoV

DelcheV, KareV, AleksandroV

the Vlachs - AlexandrU, KonstantinU, VlahU
It is clear to me, it is clear to you.

Aleksandro-y pari, Aleksandro-V stater.

Now we only have to find a way to bring those idiots in MANU to start use their head, show some dignity and start do their job.
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Old 03-17-2010, 08:50 PM   #19
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thanks boy this has been an interesting read .
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Old 06-05-2010, 04:55 AM   #20
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I found this old threet as interesting to me, cos i travel trough vilages in macedonia often, and in my area i found that when ask something like :

To whom this is belongs, other guy will simple respond JORDANOJ , or JODRANOY if they belongs to some guy called JORDAN, or NIKOLOJ, NIKOLOY (in macedonian lang Y and J sound same) so when guys in ancient times will ask to whom this coins belongs, they simple will say if they belongs to ALEKSANDAR , ALEKSANDROY or ALEKSANDROJ, whats simple meens aleksandrovi today. To underrstand the words ( from ancient time) its very simple, just talk with old guys in vilages, you will understand everything.
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