what are the benefits of a name change

[Risto the Great]

The facts are that over 80% of Macedonians still do not support this national suicide even though the media has been feeding them lies tells us something.

There are some very good reasons why the media is feared by many Governments. They have the ability to influence public opinion. You yourself have questioned the apathy of the Macedonians.

Osiris raised an essential point that Macedonians need to question on a daily basis.

"What is in it for us?"
"What empirical evidence exists to indicate we will be better off?"
"Show us examples in the Balkans of the improvements we can expect"

[fyrOM]

In the thread Greek Newspaper Serdarot alerted us to the Greek newspaper claiming a name change has been decided on. I later posted other articles pointing in this direction and the summation of my thoughts on a possible outcome. As much as I dislike the idea of a name change I think there is a serious possibility it will either happen or be put to the people as a referendum. Too many things have been said in this direction.

Rather than debating whether or not a name change should happen I would like to hear peoples thoughts if the name change were to be announce or put to a referendum how should we respond and what points should be examined eg as in the Nova Makedonia

http://www.novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=310101030304&id=13&prilog=0&setIzdanie=21930

Article it say the language is makedonski. It might seem pedantic but could be damming to say makedonski. Does this word mean it will be recorded as the literal word or its meaning and hence Macedonian and any other spelling of this word in other languages will be recorded as the language. Beware of Greek lies. A cursory view of mto can attest to the multitude of Greek lies.

Rather than repeat my post here see the thread Greek Newspaper ect by Serdarot. If things head in this direction it begs the question is the name more important or is the identity more important if the later could be separated from the former. Could we be Macedonians and our language Macedonian from North Macedonia while we see others also claim to be Macedonians and there language Greek from the province of South Macedonia in Greece.

I am not saying I like this solution. Se osejkam kako oka sol da jadam samo da se zamislam za ova ama mislam treba da pomislime za ovaa tema da imame odgovor spreman vo slucaj politicarive pokusaat da nie nametnat promenata. Is there anything to be gained by this action. what does it mean for macedonia in the short and long term if we stick it out and refuse a name change. who do we trade with.

[osiris]

"What is in it for us?"
"What empirical evidence exists to indicate we will be better off?"
"Show us examples in the Balkans of the improvements we can expect"

exactly rtg otherwise why continue engaging in the so called mediation process.
it has to be made clear to our people in rom. its not mediation its blackmail and intimidation and a complete denial of our rights as humans its an affront to our dignity and being.

why are we still involved in such a no win process.

how long has it been and so far what has it achieved

what would happen if we withdrew, what is there to lose.

[fyrOM]

Being in the eu has some benefits. One we have seen already is the eu like farm subsidies offered to our farmer. This has resulted in many benefiting a more viable business for their families which also has the knock on effect of these farmers and their families having more to spend giving more impetus to other sectors of the economy.

Another thing I have heard is a Chinese company has shown interest in opening a computer manufacturing company in Macedonia so that their products would be considered manufactured in an eu country and hence attract less tax than simply imported into the eu. We might get beef cow mein yet. There’s a reason.hahaha

[Risto the Great]

OM, here is a review of how Romania has gained from EU farm subsidies:

http://macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2299

[osiris]

are farm subsidies worth a name change, i dont think so.

all the aid and subsidies in the world could t stop greeces economic decline

[ZAS]

Don't look at Greece. We will not have any Olympic games coming to Macedonia any time soon. Look at Bulgaria and observe their poverty and lack of improvement.

The name change will be the final act, it will represent a complete acceptance of Macedonians as being not worthy of an identity. Being sub-human. I simply cannot think of anything worse.

Bravos Risto, you have left nothing out.

[fyrOM]

osiris you missed the chinese food we could get in your reply.hahahaha

[fyrOM]

Seriously though we do need to consider what if scenarios so that thoughts have time to be expressed, thought over, debated and modified for a prepared response.

Northern Macedonia is one seriously possible outcome hence its need to be discussed. This thread is exactly apt towards discussing this scenario and any alternatives.

I am not saying Northern Macedonia is our only future nor particularly want to promote it. Simply saying not this is not always enough. Alternatives also need to be considered and their viability examined.
The article
TMRO: Macedonia to look into US, not the EU
Sunday, 06 April 2008

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/673/52/

lets us consider the option going it alone with the U.S.A. if Europe will not call us by our name do we want to be part of their club and can we turn to other friends. I think Macedonia has not fully showed her potential but even what has been achieved is great when one considers from how far back we stared not only since independence but also even under tito when most major industries were not built in Macedonia. I know Jankovska and others will say its not enough but we need to remember some of our former leaders unfortunately did more for themselves than the state. Our current leaders at least appear to have their hearts in the right place.

[fyrOM]

RTG Im sure you know the story of the guptin who was made king for a day. Throwing money at people doesn’t necessarily bring class. This would need to be tackled with stricter planning laws and cultural modernisation.

As for subsidies being given to certain farmers who are of a certain size and not others is one of the deliberate negatives to rationalise farming and increase productivity. Downsizing is common place in industry in the west as a means of increasing productivity. This is the eus farming equivalent. Is there a better way of doing this. I don’t know. this is an area that could be discussed on MTO and if we come up with a better idea there always is the Presidents Letterbox.