Macedonia & Greece: Name Issue

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  • Pelagonija
    Member
    • Mar 2017
    • 533

    Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
    Really? Superior in which way?
    Ahhh? Hmmmm? In every way possible?

    Comment

    • Phoenix
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2008
      • 4671

      Originally posted by kompir View Post
      I was listening to ABC radio this afternoon and I heard something to the effect of that if the name change agreement isn't ratified, the EU and Greece will be imposing a new economic blockade and that the current border crossings between the two countries would be closed indefinitely. I don't know where they got this information from, but it is a troubling development if true.
      It sounds like a classic fake news event or plain old misinformation, or
      a psy-ops campaign orchestrated against the sheeple in Macedonia...our enemies would've done their homework on the hapless fyromian's and analysed the shallowness of their thinking and how easily they're prepared to sell their souls for a promise of fools gold or a glittering turd.

      Our enemies will use the time honoured strategy of the carrot and stick...on one hand the illusion of great opportunity will be presented to the simpleton fyromian with the disclaimer that their chance to redeem this wonderful gift has only a small window before the prize disappears forever...

      The fyromian being the gullible, self-loathing fool that he is, will jump at this 'once in a lifetime opportunity' quicker than it takes Zaev to get the fuck out of Macedonia and assume a new identity in a foreign land, once the sell off is complete.

      Comment

      • Rogi
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2008
        • 2343

        Journalism in Macedonia, at least those on the side of the Macedonian identity, is really still at quite a low level.

        I mean, nobody is even thinking about highlighting the "rot" in that carrot.

        Nobody is putting up headlines highlighting that the Macedonian name and identity is being sold NOW, for the off-chance of joining the European Union in at least 5 years from now.

        The Macedonians all have a hope to get rich quick, it all raining money overnight. It's why sports gambling is highest in Macedonia per capita than anywhere else in the world. Those on the "sell the name and you get NATO and Europe" side are onto that and playing at that, pretending like there will be money falling from the skies overnight. Nobody on the other side of the argument is tapping into what's really driving the modern Macedonian.

        Comment

        • Soldier of Macedon
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 13670

          Originally posted by Pelagonija View Post
          Ahhh? Hmmmm? In every way possible?
          If it's in every way possible it should not be that hard for you to provide a few specific examples. What are they?
          In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

          Comment

          • kompir
            Member
            • Jan 2015
            • 537

            Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
            It sounds like a classic fake news event or plain old misinformation, or
            a psy-ops campaign orchestrated against the sheeple in Macedonia...our enemies would've done their homework on the hapless fyromian's and analysed the shallowness of their thinking and how easily they're prepared to sell their souls for a promise of fools gold or a glittering turd.
            I'm thinking psy-ops, it has the stink of a think-tank wank session.

            Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
            Our enemies will use the time honoured strategy of the carrot and stick...on one hand the illusion of great opportunity will be presented to the simpleton fyromian with the disclaimer that their chance to redeem this wonderful gift has only a small window before the prize disappears forever...

            The fyromian being the gullible, self-loathing fool that he is, will jump at this 'once in a lifetime opportunity' quicker than it takes Zaev to get the fuck out of Macedonia and assume a new identity in a foreign land, once the sell off is complete.
            There is a reason this song by Solza i Smea resonates so much:

            Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
            Доста бе Вегето една, во секоја манџа се мешаш

            Comment

            • Pelagonija
              Member
              • Mar 2017
              • 533

              Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
              If it's in every way possible it should not be that hard for you to provide a few specific examples. What are they?
              Hmm it’s really a non debate.. but here is a few..

              Characteristics: How about the fact that they choose to fight? Did you know that when faced with ultimatums in WWI they chose to fight and lost half its population? The youngest soldier was 8 years mind you.. they also fought and sacrificed in WWII and in the 90s wars. Serbs are proud. No one in the Balkans have suffered as much as them in terms of numbers.

              Politically: Even today they face immense pressure to yield to NATO rule and sever ties to Russia but remain the last man standing in Europe. You didn’t see serbia expel the Russian ambassador over the staged skripal case.

              Entertainment: great at sport, music and great women.

              Economy: No comment

              Military: no comment

              Land mass: no comment

              Cut a long story short, they respect themselves our people don’t.

              Anyway I say this in the context of where our country is going, hence In hindsight the current circumstances are diabolical with no view to recovery. Do u prefer it?

              Are we superior in any aspect? I can’t see how honestly. We are a people of no pride. Self respect or morals.. yeah yeah I’m sure about %10 are top blokes but the rest are farked.

              Comment

              • kompir
                Member
                • Jan 2015
                • 537

                Originally posted by Pelagonija View Post
                Hmm it’s really a non debate.. but here is a few..

                Characteristics: How about the fact that they choose to fight? Did you know that when faced with ultimatums in WWI they chose to fight and lost half its population? The youngest soldier was 8 years mind you.. they also fought and sacrificed in WWII and in the 90s wars. Serbs are proud. No one in the Balkans have suffered as much as them in terms of numbers.

                Politically: Even today they face immense pressure to yield to NATO rule and sever ties to Russia but remain the last man standing in Europe. You didn’t see serbia expel the Russian ambassador over the staged skripal case.

                Entertainment: great at sport, music and great women.

                Economy: No comment

                Military: no comment

                Land mass: no comment

                Cut a long story short, they respect themselves our people don’t.

                Anyway I say this in the context of where our country is going, hence In hindsight the current circumstances are diabolical with no view to recovery. Do u prefer it?

                Are we superior in any aspect? I can’t see how honestly. We are a people of no pride. Self respect or morals.. yeah yeah I’m sure about %10 are top blokes but the rest are farked.
                Their women are crazy, batshit crazy
                Доста бе Вегето една, во секоја манџа се мешаш

                Comment

                • Soldier of Macedon
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 13670

                  Originally posted by Pelagonija View Post
                  Characteristics
                  They had their own state and army. We didn't. They chose to fight because they knew they had the largest army in the world (Russia) and other Great Powers on their side against the Austrians and Germans. We were occupied by those same Serbs at that time. If you're going to make comparisons, then compare apples for apples. As for WWII, we also fought. As for the 90's wars, a lot of good that did for them. As for their pride, pride in what? They lost their 'Greater Serbia' in the former Yugoslavia, most of their centuries-old population in Croatia is no longer there and they no longer have control of Kosovo.
                  Politically
                  Yeah, it was good of them to stand firm on that ambassador situation, that was disgraceful on Macedonia's part, but not really a sign of superiority, just the right political party in power at the time. And as for facing immense pressure, don't be so certain. Vucic is on the verge of making an agreement on Kosovo and he has hinted at that several times in the past year. I have Serb friends, their impression of Vucic is the same as some our impressions of Gruevski, a half-patriot at best, deceitful traitor at worst.
                  Entertainment
                  They're good in sports, but they have more people than us so more options to choose from. As for music and women, lol, get a grip.
                  Economy
                  Don't be fooled by the glittering lights of Belgrade. For a country that has 3 times the population of Macedonia, Serbia's GDP is a little over 3 times that of Macedonia (2016) but has a per capita income that is less than Macedonia (2016). I'm not the greatest economist out there, but that doesn't strike me as being superior, at least not in the way you're presenting it.
                  Military
                  They spend much more of their money on the military, naturally it will be superior to ours. That has nothing to do with people.
                  Land mass
                  Compare Serb-controlled territories now from about 30 years ago. Not so superior.
                  Cut a long story short, they respect themselves our people don’t.
                  You're generalising. I can assure you there are plenty of self-loathing morons in Serbia, just like in Macedonia. Given the amount of people they have compared to ours, I would say the percentage of patriots or nationalists aren't that different.
                  Are we superior in any aspect? I can’t see how honestly. We are a people of no pride. Self respect or morals.. yeah yeah I’m sure about %10 are top blokes but the rest are farked.
                  We're both Balkan nations. They have some advantages over us because they achieved statehood earlier than us. Aside from that, there isn't much more. If I was you I would take it easy with this "superiority" crap. Macedonians who were saying that back in the early 1900's ended up doing the bidding of their enemies.
                  In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                  Comment

                  • Risto the Great
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 15658

                    Serbs often state they are pathetic in comparison to Croats. I tend to agree. I am of the opinion that many Macedonians whose parents are from the republic still have something in their psyche that sees Serbs as superior to Macedonians.

                    Egejci have nothing of this and no comprehension of this in relation to Serbs. Instead (unfortunately) many suffer from all kinds of inadequacy comparing themselves to Greeks.

                    In a nutshell, it comes from oppression and victim mentality. And surely we in the diaspora can be above that kind of thinking.
                    Risto the Great
                    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                    Comment

                    • Niko777
                      Senior Member
                      • Oct 2010
                      • 1895

                      Is Greece About To Lay Legal Claim To Atatürk And His Legacy?

                      It’s absurd to consider the founding father of the modern-day Turkish state as anything other than a Turk, but if the Greek Parliament passes the recently concluded “name deal” with Macedonia, then Athens will legally be obliged to regard everything in Greek Macedonia – including Atatürk, who was born in the regional capital of Thessaloniki – as having the “attribute” of being part of “Hellenic civilization, history, culture and heritage…from antiquity to the present day”.

                      Link: https://www.eurasiafuture.com/2018/0...nd-his-legacy/

                      Comment

                      • Pelagonija
                        Member
                        • Mar 2017
                        • 533

                        Fellas don’t take it the wrong way, we can cherry pick various points. But th hard facts are:

                        1) FYROM is in the process of selling out themselves in the most pathetic of ways and reasons and people couldn’t care less.

                        2) Serbs stick up for their beliefs no matter the odds.

                        I could replace the Serbs with the Croats or whoever, it doesn’t matter. Making a point that our people are soft and disappointing, I don’t think anything good has come out an independent NMK. If it has do let me know. Today’s Slav Macedonians are pissing on the dead, the people who fought for the place. On a side note, I remember the end of the Bosnian war, when it ended the Serbs unburied their dead from sarejevo and took them to their new homes.

                        It’s all about the fight. We don’t have it as we are inferior.

                        Comment

                        • maco2envy
                          Member
                          • Jan 2015
                          • 288

                          Originally posted by Niko777 View Post
                          Is Greece About To Lay Legal Claim To Atatürk And His Legacy?

                          It’s absurd to consider the founding father of the modern-day Turkish state as anything other than a Turk, but if the Greek Parliament passes the recently concluded “name deal” with Macedonia, then Athens will legally be obliged to regard everything in Greek Macedonia – including Atatürk, who was born in the regional capital of Thessaloniki – as having the “attribute” of being part of “Hellenic civilization, history, culture and heritage…from antiquity to the present day”.

                          Link: https://www.eurasiafuture.com/2018/0...nd-his-legacy/
                          Same with Goce Delcev... lol

                          Comment

                          • Tomche Makedonche
                            Senior Member
                            • Oct 2011
                            • 1123

                            Macedonia's landmark agreement with Greece over its name has passed its first hurdle, after the country's parliament ratified the deal on Wednesday.


                            Macedonia's Parliament Ratifies Historic Deal With Greece

                            Macedonia's landmark agreement with Greece over its name has passed its first hurdle, after the country's parliament ratified the deal on Wednesday

                            Macedonia's parliamentarians on Wednesday approved the long-negotiated agreement with Greece over the country's name, with all 69 deputies who attended the session voting in favour. Opposition deputies boycotted the session, however. Parliament has 120 seats.

                            Under the historic agreement, Macedonia is to change its name to “Republic of North Macedonia” in exchange for swift accession to NATO and a start to EU accession talks.

                            Zoran Zaev, Macedonian Prime Minister and leader of the ruling Social Democratic Union, SDSM, said before the vote that an invitation for Macedonia to join NATO would be discussed at the next NATO summit on July 11.

                            Now the agreement has been ratified by Macedonia's parliament, Greece is also expected to promptly permit the EU to start accession talks with Macedonia.

                            Although hundreds of people protested against the deal in the days following the signing of the agreement, no such protests marred Wednesday's vote in Skopje.

                            Opponents of the deal have mulled gathering in the evening, however.

                            President Gjorge Ivanov, an opponent of the agreement, issued a statement earlier on Wednesday reaffirming that he will not support the deal even if Prime Minister Zaev launches impeachment procedures.

                            His statement followed Zaev’s interview with TV Kanal 5, aired on Tuesday, in which he said that his coalition was ready to take moves against Ivanov.

                            Macedonia's President can delay but not stop the deal from moving forward, as his powers are limited.

                            The next steps for the deal's implementation this year include a potentially risky referendum on the deal in Macedonia, which will put Zaev’s government to the test
                            “There’s a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart, that you can’t take part, you can’t even passively take part, and you’ve got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus and you’ve got to make it stop, and you’ve got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you’re free, the machine will be prevented from working at all” - Mario Savio

                            Comment

                            • Tomche Makedonche
                              Senior Member
                              • Oct 2011
                              • 1123

                              Originally posted by Pelagonija View Post
                              It’s all about the fight. We don’t have it as we are inferior.
                              If we were inferior, we would have gone extinct a long time ago, and our oppressors would not continue to fear the consequences of our mere existence.
                              “There’s a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart, that you can’t take part, you can’t even passively take part, and you’ve got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus and you’ve got to make it stop, and you’ve got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you’re free, the machine will be prevented from working at all” - Mario Savio

                              Comment

                              • Risto the Great
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2008
                                • 15658

                                Those that didn't ratify the vote because they weren't there are complicit. I'm sick of this "I wasn't there, don't blame me* bullshit.
                                Risto the Great
                                MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                                "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                                Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                                Comment

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