Greece should look to Turkey for guidance

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  • Risto the Great
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 15658

    Greece should look to Turkey for guidance

    Even Turkey has shown a more progressive attitude in relation to it's Kurdish minority than the Greeks. Note the similar tactics of denial .... Some analysts consider the new channel a sort of revolution for Turkey, considering that between 1983 and 1991 it was illegal to speak Kurdish.


    The state-run Turkish Radio and Television's (TRT) new Kurdish-language channel, TRT-6, went on the air with an image of the Turkish flag being hoisted to the sound of the country's national anthem on January 1.

    Earlier the same day, Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Edrogan became the first Turkish leader to speak Kurdish publicly when he said, "May TRT-6 be beneficial."

    Back in 2004, TRT began a weekly 30-minute Kurdish broadcast. The move was widely seen as a response to European Union pressure to strengthen the rights of the Kurdish minority.

    But the 24-hour broadcasts go far beyond that.

    Mustafa Akyol, a Turkish columnist and political commentator, says that the political establishment in his country appears to have realized that Turkey's obsession with being a "homogenous" nation -- and the idea that the country should have one common "Turkish" culture -- has backfired.

    "The state has seen its mistake. And for a while, especially under the current government [of the] Justice and Development Party -- and thanks to [joining] the European Union process - the Turkish state has started to change its policy and embrace Kurdish citizens [along] with their identity," Akyol says.

    "Having a Kurdish channel in TRT -- its a very important thing. It would be unthinkable 10 years ago," he adds. "And I know that many Kurds are happy to see this."

    Countering Radical Voices

    Turkey's 15 million Kurds make up some 20 percent of the Turkish population. They live predominantly in the east and southeast along the Iranian, Iraqi, and Syrian borders. Currently, the Denmark-based Roj TV is the most popular station among Turkey's Kurds.

    But Turkish officials consider the station to be a mouthpiece for the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK) -- a rebel group fighting for Kurdish autonomy since 1984 that Ankara, Washington, and the European Union have declared a terrorist organization.

    Akyol says countering the message of Kurdish nationalist satellite channels such as Roj TV is one obvious reason the new Kurdish station was launched, because official attempts to stop people from watching the broadcasts failed.

    He says the TRT programs will be aimed at providing "Kurdish broadcasts, which would not be supporting radical Kurdish nationalism and would be supporting a more unifying message."

    But he sees deeper motives involved as Turkey moves toward greater democratization and its government and institutions also adjust to 21st-century realities.

    "Now there is more media than there has ever been. More people are educated and the economy is integrated to the world. It is a much more diverse society and the state is trying to cope with that reality," Akyol says.
    Risto the Great
    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com
  • TerraNova
    Banned
    • Nov 2008
    • 473

    #2
    "Greece should look to Turkey for guidance"

    ...Are you sure ?


    (Turkish soldier holding heads of a Kurdish family members...)

    Comment

    • Demos
      Banned
      • Dec 2008
      • 325

      #3
      Originally posted by TerraNova View Post
      "Greece should look to Turkey for guidance"

      ...Are you sure ?


      (Turkish soldier holding heads of a Kurdish family members...)
      Risto,

      On September 5th, 1955 we had a Kristallnacht type event against the Greeks of Constantinople by the Turks. I highly doubt that the Greeks should be looking up to the "civilized" and "humane" Turks for guidance.

      Comment

      • Risto the Great
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2008
        • 15658

        #4
        That was a horrible photo. I recall Greeks doing similar things 100 years earlier in Macedonia. I had been quite disgusted how the Turks had treated the Kurds up until now. I am quite sure we will not see anything like that again.
        Sure, they are still in the dark ages in some regards.
        But have now finally accepted they are not an homogeneous nation and are now making attempts to appease the Kurdish minority. Which places them ahead of Greece in terms of rights for minorities. Do you deny this?
        Risto the Great
        MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
        "Holding my breath for the revolution."

        Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

        Comment

        • TerraNova
          Banned
          • Nov 2008
          • 473

          #5
          Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
          That was a horrible photo. I recall Greeks doing similar things 100 years earlier in Macedonia. I had been quite disgusted how the Turks had treated the Kurds up until now. I am quite sure we will not see anything like that again.
          Sure, they are still in the dark ages in some regards.
          But have now finally accepted they are not an homogeneous nation and are now making attempts to appease the Kurdish minority. Which places them ahead of Greece in terms of rights for minorities. Do you deny this?
          Wait a minute...

          Turkey launched attacks against Kurdish villages in Southeastern Turkey and even Northern Iraq some months ago.

          Comment

          • Demos
            Banned
            • Dec 2008
            • 325

            #6
            Originally posted by TerraNova View Post
            Wait a minute...

            Turkey launched attacks against Kurdish villages in Southeastern Turkey and even Northern Iraq some months ago.
            Maybe Risto is right...maybe Greece should follow the Turkish example.

            Comment

            • Risto the Great
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 15658

              #7
              I know, I know ... I did say "up until now".
              They did it with full USA support because the USA did not want Kurdish blood on their hands.
              I love it how Greeks are concerned for Turkish minorities but cannot smell the irony in their own backyard.
              Risto the Great
              MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
              "Holding my breath for the revolution."

              Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

              Comment

              • TerraNova
                Banned
                • Nov 2008
                • 473

                #8
                Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                I know, I know ... I did say "up until now".
                They did it with full USA support because the USA did not want Kurdish blood on their hands.
                I love it how Greeks are concerned for Turkish minorities but cannot smell the irony in their own backyard.
                Kurds are estimated between 14 and 20 millions.
                They are not recognized as a minority.

                Comment

                • Demos
                  Banned
                  • Dec 2008
                  • 325

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                  I know, I know ... I did say "up until now".
                  They did it with full USA support because the USA did not want Kurdish blood on their hands.
                  I love it how Greeks are concerned for Turkish minorities but cannot smell the irony in their own backyard.
                  Risto,

                  The only reason why the Turks are becoming more open to the idea of the Kurds is because of the demographic problem (by 2050 half the population of Turkey will be Kurdish), kind of in the same way you guys are worried with Albanian demographics which is already at 25% and growing.

                  That's why Gruevski is trying to offset this by offering incentives to Macedonians to have more children.

                  Comment

                  • Risto the Great
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 15658

                    #10
                    Silly me, this is all merely a numbers game and I was just thinking the Turks were nice enough to let some other ethnicities have a TV station in their own language.
                    The Turks did not have gun to their head to implement change.
                    Greece should do the same. I would even accept a "SlavoMakedonski" hour on TV every day in Greece. Along with a nice cultural centre in Lerin ... Hey I could even donate some land to the cause.



                    Why can't the Greeks be friends with the Turks like in the good old days ... you know when the Greek priests would bless the Turkish cannons before they were fired upon the Macedonians.
                    Risto the Great
                    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                    Comment

                    • TerraNova
                      Banned
                      • Nov 2008
                      • 473

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                      Silly me, this is all merely a numbers game and I was just thinking the Turks were nice enough to let some other ethnicities have a TV station in their own language.
                      The Turks did not have gun to their head to implement change.
                      Greece should do the same. I would even accept a "SlavoMakedonski" hour on TV every day in Greece. Along with a nice cultural centre in Lerin ... Hey I could even donate some land to the cause.
                      Why don't you have a Greek hour on TV in RoM ?

                      (C mon..don't tell me abt numbers..you just say it's not a number's game..)

                      Why can't the Greeks be friends with the Turks like in the good old days ... you know when the Greek priests would bless the Turkish cannons before they were fired upon the Macedonians.
                      You were taught these...Greek nationalists were taught the opposite -that Bulgarian komitajis were helped by the Turks.(see murder of Paulos Melas)
                      ...
                      I live in 2008,and i can see a love of Turkey in RoM.

                      (BTW..i dont have a problem with Turks- i was in Istanbul for Xmas ,with Turkish friends )

                      Comment

                      • Soldier of Macedon
                        Senior Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 13670

                        #12
                        Originally posted by TerraNova
                        You were taught these...Greek nationalists were taught the opposite
                        Really? They didn't teach you about the 'Greek' leader Spyros and his Turkish friend Adam, and their lovely partnership of terrorism against the local Macedonian-speaking villages that found themselves within the Exarchate?


                        What about that pig that used to call himself a bishop, Karavangeli, an apparent man of the cloth, an 'Orthodox Christian', blessing Turkish cannons before they fire into Macedonian villages? They didn't teach you that either? Here is what Brailsford says about it:

                        .........once more a photograph caught my eye. It showed the Turkish authorities standing in full-dress round a Turkish cannon, and in their midst, handsome, conspicuous, with an air of mastery and command, was the Archbishop (Karavangelis) himself. And then I remembered another tale, which told how his Grace had sent his bravoes to guide the Turkish troops in their work of massacre, and blessed the cannon that were to batter the Bulgarian villages to dust.....


                        I find it a bit rich that modern Greeks wish to inform us how wrong our alliances are with the Turks yet when it mattered most in the early 20th century they were working together against the Macedonians! Contradicting standards seems to be a common characteristic of the modern Greek.

                        Showing pictures of some poor Kurds with their heads being held as prizes by Turkish soldiers, and using this as an excuse to put the Greeks on a higher moral ground against the Turks is ridiculous, when your own priests were guilty of worse against people of their own Christian faith. In the early 20th century, Brailsford actually visited the pig Karavangeli at his residence, here is another observation in Chapter 7:
                        ...........there, above my head, on the wall, in a conspicuous place, hung the photograph of a ghastly head, severed at the neck, with a bullet through the jaw, dripping blood. And then I remembered the tale. That head had belonged to a Bulgarian chief. A band of bravoes in the Archbishop's pay had murdered him as he lay wounded in hiding. And the tale went on to tell how the murderers carried the bleeding trophy to the Palace, and how the Archbishop had had it photographed and paid its price in fifty pieces of gold.
                        This is supposed to be a man of the Church and Christianity, and he has a picture of the head of a fellow Christian hanging up in his room as a trophy!

                        With regard to the title of this thread, I think that Greeks long ago looked to the Turks for 'guidance' on how to do things.
                        In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                        Comment

                        • Bratot
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 2855

                          #13
                          Originally posted by TerraNova View Post


                          You were taught these...Greek nationalists were taught the opposite -that Bulgarian komitajis were helped by the Turks.(see murder of Paulos Melas)

                          Ohh my, please tell us about the murder of Melas

                          Thats the funniest story.

                          Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
                          Really? They didn't teach you about the 'Greek' leader Spyros and his Turkish friend Adam, and their lovely partnership of terrorism against the local Macedonian-speaking villages that found themselves within the Exarchate?


                          What about that pig that used to call himself a bishop, Karavangeli, an apparent man of the cloth, an 'Orthodox Christian', blessing Turkish cannons before they fire into Macedonian villages? They didn't teach you that either? Here is what Brailsford says about it:





                          I find it a bit rich that modern Greeks wish to inform us how wrong our alliances are with the Turks yet when it mattered most in the early 20th century they were working together against the Macedonians! Contradicting standards seems to be a common characteristic of the modern Greek.

                          Showing pictures of some poor Kurds with their heads being held as prizes by Turkish soldiers, and using this as an excuse to put the Greeks on a higher moral ground against the Turks is ridiculous, when your own priests were guilty of worse against people of their own Christian faith. In the early 20th century, Brailsford actually visited the pig Karavangeli at his residence, here is another observation in Chapter 7:


                          This is supposed to be a man of the Church and Christianity, and he has a picture of the head of a fellow Christian hanging up in his room as a trophy!

                          With regard to the title of this thread, I think that Greeks long ago looked to the Turks for 'guidance' on how to do things.


                          Nice post SoM,
                          and another photo, Greek andarts in front of Turkish flag

                          The purpose of the media is not to make you to think that the name must be changed, but to get you into debate - what name would suit us! - Bratot

                          Comment

                          • Soldier of Macedon
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 13670

                            #14
                            STORM CENTRES OF THE NEAR EAST by Sir Robert Graves ,1933, page 211-212.
                            Worst of all was the massacre and destruction of the large village of Zagoritchani in Southern Monastir, of which the Greek Archbishop of Castoria was an interested spectator in company with the Turkish Commanding Officer.
                            In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

                            Comment

                            • Brian
                              Banned
                              • Oct 2011
                              • 1130

                              #15
                              Sounds like the Greeks 'New Daddy', Germany, Uk, ect, have had enough with them like a troublesome kid and want them to look to their 'Old Daddy', the Turks, for guidence.LOL.

                              Turkey's 15 million Kurds make up some 20 percent of the Turkish population.
                              Now imagine if they had 25%, they could run the whole country with the USA's blessing.

                              Comment

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