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View Full Version : Makedonski Jazik - Macedonian Language


Soldier of Macedon
01-11-2009, 05:31 AM
Тука можиме да зборуваме и пишуваме за нашиот мајчински јазик, Македонски, во било кои дијалект. Македонскиот јазик е стар и богат, треба да си го чуваме за секогаш и да учиме за него колку што можиме, да бидиме сигурно дека никогаш нема да се загине.

Tuka mozhime da zboruvame i pishuvame za nashiot maychinski yazik, Makedonski, vo bilo koi diyalekt. Makedonskiot yazik e star i bogat, treba da si go chuvame za sekogash i da uchime za nego kolku shto mozhime, da bidime sigurno deka nikogash nema da se zagine.

Here we can talk and write about our mother-tongue, Macedonian, in whichever dialect. The Macedonian language is old and rich, we need to keep it forever and learn as much as we can about it, so we can ensure that it will never be lost.

Soldier of Macedon
01-11-2009, 05:45 AM
Како прво, сакам да покажам една реченица по мојот Битолски дијалект. Многу пати Македонци скратуват зборови, и некогаш е тешко да се разбира, ама мислам дека скоро сите Македонци разбираат ваквко скратување и самите го прават во нивните краишта.
Kako prvo, sakam da pokazham edna rechenitsa po moyot Bitolski diyalekt. Mnogu pati Makedontsi skratuvat zborovi, i nekogash e teshko da se razbira, ama mislam deka skoro site Makedontsi razbiraat vakvko skratuvanye i samite go pravat vo nivnite kraishta.

Едно прашање сега за моите Македонци, дали го разбирате ова:
Edno prashanye sega za moite Makedontsi, dali go razbirate ova:

Еј шо праиме сеа ке јаиме, ај доиси уше поике!
Ey sho praime sea ke yaime, ay doisi ushe poike!

Koi drug taka go veli? Who else says it as such?

I find that in my family we tend to use formalised words when extra emphasis is added, for example, I remember a difference as a child from when my old man would say 'sea' as opposed to 'sega'!! :)

Risto the Great
01-11-2009, 07:50 AM
Еј шо праиме сеа ке јаиме, ај доиси уше поике!
Chisto Lerinsko, except we would say "donesi" instead of "doisi"

Risto the Great
01-11-2009, 07:52 AM
Lerinsko: nekade druzhe = somewhere else

Dimko-piperkata
01-11-2009, 08:02 AM
Едно прашање сега за моите Македонци, дали го разбирате ова:


Еј шо праиме сеа ке јаиме, ај доиси уше поике!


we, the mijaks in ореше would say:

шо правиш сега ќе јадеме, ајде донеси повише.

Soldier of Macedon
01-11-2009, 08:51 AM
we, the mijaks in ореше would say:

шо правиш сега ќе јадеме, ајде донеси повише.
Thanks Dimko, Georgi Pulja was a Mijak too, as you would know ;)

Lerinsko: nekade druzhe = somewhere else
In Bitolsko, 'nekade' and 'negde' are both used, in fact, sometimes the word 'negde' sounds like 'neigde'. For example, I would say the above as "neigde drugo" - However, I know a guy from Mariovo, Selo Dunje, who says "druzhe" instead of "drugo".

Dimko-piperkata
01-11-2009, 09:04 AM
Thanks Dimko, Georgi Pulja was a Mijak too, as you would know ;)
u should watch the video "krvavo dosie" which i will present today, u will be amazed about the mijaks ;)

ps
you gave me an idea with this thread.

i will create a list, with words who only we mijaks in oreshe are using, like
gombelki=kompiri
chepurki=pechurki
a.s.o.

the list should be enlarged by all dialects/regions ... i just told my parents to start a list ;)

how about it ???

Soldier of Macedon
01-11-2009, 09:49 PM
Excellent idea Dimko! In Pulevski's book there are also some Mijak words recorded, that will be a good place to find some too.;)

Coolski
01-12-2009, 04:09 AM
Еј шо праиме сеа ке јаиме, ај доиси уше поике!
Ке го пуштам синми вградо да ги нај работите, ама ке треба да ој пеш.

Сине, еве 500 дин.. купи ни пиво и шќембе (хехехе).

Soldier of Macedon
01-12-2009, 04:52 AM
E sea ne si om sam, aj ke poime zaedno;)

This is the secret language within the Macedonian language:D

Bratot
01-12-2009, 05:34 AM
Online tutorials and dictionaries for Macedonian language


Македонска АЗБУКА/ Macedonian alphabet:

http://macedoniadirect.com/azbuka.htm


EN-MK Convertor is a small web application that performs conversion of text from English latin to Cyrillic alphabet:

http://www.agora.org.mk/goodbytes/enmkonvert/default.asp

РЕЧНИЦИ/DICTIONARIES:

http://rechnik.on.net.mk/

http://www.freelang.net/dictionary/macedonian.html

http://www.geocities.com/dawilsey/mak


http://www.idividi.com.mk/recnik


Лекции и примери/ Lessons&examples:

http://www.seelrc.org:8080/grammar/m...?nLanguageID=3


http://www.geocities.com/macedonian_lng/


http://seelrc.org:8080/grammar/pdf/s...macedonian.pdf


Интерактивен туторијал/ Interactive tutorial:

http://www.unc.edu/~bbiljana/MKDtutorial.html


Бесплатен софтвер за Македонски Јазик/ Free software for MK language:

http://www.byki.com/fls/free-macedon...l?l=macedonian



За оние кои се во странство и сакаат да набават речници и во исто време да им посочат на нивните пријатели кои се интересираат или планираат да дојдат во МК:

http://www.macedonia.co.uk/client/WebForm1.aspx?pid=6

AMINTA
01-12-2009, 09:25 AM
chisto lerinsko, except we would say "donesi" instead of "doisi"

Се согласувам, мојата баба бог да ја прости велеше така чисто Лерински... од мојот крај. :d

Dimko-piperkata
01-16-2009, 06:11 AM
Excellent idea Dimko! In Pulevski's book there are also some Mijak words recorded, that will be a good place to find some too.;)

here we go guys!

MIJAK/MIYAK ONLINE DICTIONARY is available!
actualy only a few words are booked but we are trying to keep it rolling !
the mijak site/project is a sub-project of greater project with following sub-projects.
palatica is the creator of that huge project and needs help to fill the "different sites" we hope to get help from u guys, we await/need some support....but now enjoy and discover...

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/mijak_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/mijak/V1.2/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/words_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/old_words/v1.0/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/books_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/bookz/v4/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/lyrics_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/lyrics/v1/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/cover_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/cover/v2/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/music_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/muzika/v2.5/)

http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/pictures_02.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/pictures/v1/)

MAIN PAGE
http://makedonium.mkd.net/images/makedonium-klein.jpg (http://makedonium.mkd.net/)

Soldier of Macedon
01-18-2009, 06:05 AM
Who else would say "ко ќе поиш земи две ако моиш, и не се ганзаи ногу"? :)

Soldier of Macedon
01-22-2009, 10:45 PM
Who else would say "ко ќе поиш земи две ако моиш, и не се ганзаи ногу"? :)
Anybody??

How about these words, "klafti", and "shtitsa", anybody else know these?

Rogi
01-22-2009, 11:46 PM
Yeah, I think klafti is to laugh (in a stupid way, I think)... like "Ne se klafti". Right?

And a shtitsa is a plank of wood.


Your first line sounds selsko Prilepsko... Prilepcani like to shorten down the words like 'ojme' 'pojme' 'dojme' instead of odime, pojdime, dojdime or 'ke om, ke pom, ke dom' instead of 'ke otidam, ke pojdam, ke dojdam'

Risto the Great
01-22-2009, 11:52 PM
who else says "puli"?

Soldier of Macedon
01-23-2009, 12:02 AM
Yeah, I think klafti is to laugh (in a stupid way, I think)... like "Ne se klafti". Right?

And a shtitsa is a plank of wood.


Your first line sounds selsko Prilepsko... Prilepcani like to shorten down the words like 'ojme' 'pojme' 'dojme' instead of odime, pojdime, dojdime or 'ke om, ke pom, ke dom' instead of 'ke otidam, ke pojdam, ke dojdam'
So do Bitolchani my friend ;) In fact, what you wrote up there sounds more Bitolsko than Prilepsko :p Che om, che jam i che dom. :D

You are correct with Klafti and Shtitsa, I wonder if it exists in other Slavic languages?


How about Ganzai, does anybody else use it?

RTG, Puli is used in nearly all if not all Macedonian dialects. Here is how I would use it:

"Opuli se vamu" (Look over here)

"Sho se pulish" (What are you looking at)

We also use other words related to 'sight', such as:

"Glei gi detsata" or "Gledai gi detsata" (Watch the children)

"Go vide choeko" (Did you see the guy)

"Se vidoa brakyata" (The brothers saw each other)

MapleLeaf1
01-23-2009, 06:48 PM
I use puli, shtitsa, vide, vidoa, ke oa, ke doa
My wife uses ne smeash, for not allowed rarther than not laughing, is that a standard thing or is it Mariovco dialect:confused:
Anyone use nazumguzum, for backwards :D

Soldier of Macedon
01-23-2009, 11:51 PM
Ne se smei - Don't laugh (Smei coming from Smevai = Smile, Laugh)
Ne smeish - You are not allowed to.

malenka
01-27-2009, 05:03 AM
чом че ам че дом :d

Sarafot
01-27-2009, 02:26 PM
Ne gledam poanta,šo sakate da kažete,da ima nogu dialekti,jas si go sakam mojot vije vašiot i taka.

Jas si dumam vinički,gleaš taka nie viničani dumame,i sega skopjani i bitolčani ke ne ubeduvat da vikame što!
Mk
-Se utepavme
Vn
-Utepame se
Mk
-Se vrativme
Vn
-Vrname se
Mk
-kaj-kade si
Vn
-Deka si be
Mk
-Go turkav
Vn
-Butnah go
Mk
-Blagodaram
Vn
-Fala
Mk
-kaval
Vn
-svorče

Eh koku sakam da sum star viničanec,so moot ruski saat zakačen na lanec,esnafskata jas po kefo da si teram....:)

Risto the Great
01-27-2009, 05:47 PM
Mk
-kaval
Vn
-svorče

svorče ?

svirče .... I play it every night.

Soldier of Macedon
01-30-2009, 03:50 AM
ne gledam poanta,šo sakate da kažete,da ima nogu dialekti,jas si go sakam mojot vije vašiot i taka.

Jas si dumam vinički,gleaš taka nie viničani dumame,i sega skopjani i bitolčani ke ne ubeduvat da vikame što, epa turam go na strina im.
"Поантата" е баш тоа, дека има ногу диалекти и треба да се запознаиме поике со ним. И така не се збора за други Македонци заради некои будали, размисли малце шо велиш.

malenka
02-13-2009, 04:22 AM
Ја секогаш си думам на дијалект па с'га кој не ме разбира мош и да му преведам ако си попита убаво :)

Soldier of Macedon
02-13-2009, 07:00 AM
Ја секогаш си думам на дијалект па с'га кој не ме разбира мош и да му преведам ако си попита убаво :)
Јас секоаш си зборам на диалект па сега кои не ме разбира мож и да му преведам ако си праша убo!

Diabolical
02-19-2009, 07:33 AM
Не сум сигурен, но мислам правилно се велит (Охриѓанец прав:Д) "виделе" наместо "видоа"? Или во некои дијалекти можи така се велит, незнам.

И јас ги употребувувам зборовите, "пули", "штица."

За ганзаи, не сум чул. Да не значи "гази" или несто слично? "Клафти" не знам... Знам само "Кафти" и "Кези" на пример, "Ај бе не кафти се" или "што се кезиш."

Хмм, за Охридски зборови не ми текви... за братучед, велиме брачед.

Еве повелете на овошје хехе :): пепун, карпус, патлижан...

Soldier of Macedon
02-19-2009, 08:25 PM
Ganzai means somebody who is doing something slow, lazy, mucking around, not taking what you are doing seriously, etc.

Ajde ne se 'ganzai' oti ima rabota = Come on stop 'mucking around' (moving slowly) because we have work to do.

Klafti = Laugh or Giggle.

Soldier of Macedon
02-23-2009, 07:11 AM
Here are some words from the 'Mijak Dialect' of Macedonia compared to their more common Macedonian equivalents, as cited by Gorgi Pulevski during the 19th century:

Gljagolit - zboruvat
Gljagolj - rech (zbor)
Gljagoli - zborovi
Gljagoljushte - zboruvashe
Gljagoleje - zborveje
Kotoman - bogat domakjin i zapovednik
Manuk - muzh
Manuka - zhena
Manuche - dete
Nokotka - devojka
Nokotche - devojche
Kordalen - vdovec
Kordalenica - vdovica


I find these words very interesting indeed, both them and their translation, as written by Pulevski.

El Bre
02-23-2009, 09:03 PM
Kusni or grisni?

osiris
02-23-2009, 09:33 PM
som are you sure you are only 30 something, your knowledge of macedonian words is pretty impressive.

Diabolical
02-23-2009, 10:09 PM
Here are some words from the 'Mijak Dialect' of Macedonia compared to their more common Macedonian equivalents, as cited by Gorgi Pulevski during the 19th century:

Gljagolit - zboruvat
Gljagolj - rech (zbor)
Gljagoli - zborovi
Gljagoljushte - zboruvashe
Gljagoleje - zborveje
Kotoman - bogat domakjin i zapovednik
Manuk - muzh
Manuka - zhena
Manuche - dete
Nokotka - devojka
Nokotche - devojche
Kordalen - vdovec
Kordalenica - vdovica


I find these words very interesting indeed, both them and their translation, as written by Pulevski.

Could that be where the present day word for "verb" (Glagol) comes from?

Soldier of Macedon
02-24-2009, 12:07 AM
Could that be where the present day word for "verb" (Glagol) comes from?
The word ultimately comes from Old Church Slavonic, where it also means to 'speak'. In common Macedonian today, it would mean a 'verb'.

Check this thread,

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=703&page=2

You will notice a discussion about the word Glas/Golos, it is likely connected Glagol and to the Greek word Glossa (tongue).

Soldier of Macedon
02-28-2009, 05:46 AM
Kusni or grisni?
Kasni, Kasai - Bite
Grizni, Grizi - Nibble, Grind

We use both.

Soldier of Macedon
03-01-2009, 04:36 AM
How about the Macedonian word for 'kick'? We say Klotsa, the Bulgars have something close in K'ch, while the Serbs have Kitsk. However, the first word that comes up for kick in Bulgarian is Ritnik.

In Greek there is Klotsia, which is pretty much the same in Macedonian. However, there is also Kutsaino which means to 'limp', formed by dropping the 'L', which is common in some Slavic dialects, other examples being Bulgar to Bugar, Solntse to Sontse, Jabolko to Jaboko, etc. Macedonians also have the dance called 'Kutsano'.

The motion of kicking and limping draws a link here, and as the 'TS' sound is not native to the Greek tongue, its origin can be questioned. What do the rest of you guys think?

Spartan
03-01-2009, 10:01 AM
We refer to someone who is lame as 'o koutsos'

Risto the Great
03-01-2009, 03:39 PM
So what is a koutsovlach?

El Bre
03-01-2009, 04:19 PM
So what is a koutsovlach?

A Romanian with a limp?

Spartan
03-01-2009, 10:31 PM
^^
Bingo, lol

Soldier of Macedon
03-02-2009, 06:48 AM
Kutsa (limp in Bulgar)
Kulhavost (limp in Czech)
Kul'gae (limp in Ukrainian)

Risto the Great
03-02-2009, 06:51 AM
Koutsovlachs = Vlachs that ceased being nomads?

Soldier of Macedon
03-02-2009, 07:02 AM
Vlachs that limped their way into Hellenism, lol.

Soldier of Macedon
03-10-2009, 07:46 AM
A little breakdown of words in the Macedonian language and of what origin they are. It is rather clear than the loanwords present are not significant or a necessity, as more often than not there is a equivalent native word.

Kinship Terms are all common Slavic words and show glimpses of a patriarchal-type society and culture.

Father - Tatko
Mother - Majka
Sister - Sestra
Brother - Brat
Son - Sin
Daughter - Kjerka
Cousin - Bra(tu)ched
Uncle - Striko, Chicho, Vujko
Aunty - Tetka
Grandfather - Dedo
Grandmother - Baba


Marine Terms are all common Slavic words, which means that these elements were not foreign to the Slavic tongues, unlike Albanian for example where nearly all these equivalent terms are Latin or Italian loanwords.

Fish - Riba
Sand - Pesok
Water - Voda
River - Reka
Lake - Ezero
Sea - More
Beach - Plazha


Body Parts are all common Slavic words.

Head - Glava
Body - Telo
Eye - Oko
Ear - Uvo
Mouth - Usta
Fingers - Prsti, Palec
Hand - Raka
Leg - Noga


Animal Names are an interesting group. It seems that the animals which are more traditionally known as 'older', native, from the forest, etc have names which are common Slavic words, while some others such as domestic type animals, pests, etc are local or loanwords. This is not exclusively the case though.

Lion - Lav
Bird - Ptica, Pile
Fox - Lisica
Wolf - Volk
Bear - Mechka
Snake - Zmija
Turtle - Zhelka
Cat - Machka
Dog - Pes (Also Kuche)
Mouse - Glushets (Unique)
Owl - Buf (Latin)*

*Buljina in Croatian, Buhal in Bulgarian, Buf in Albanian, Bufnita in Romanian, Bufo in Portuguese, Buho in Spanish. It seems to be a Latin loanword, the common Slavic word for an 'owl' is Sova.



I will come up with some more later.

Soldier of Macedon
03-10-2009, 08:20 AM
What a beautiful Macedonian dialect!

YouTube - Dialect from Suho Aegean Macedonia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uh2rhqK3aE)

Risto the Great
03-10-2009, 05:38 PM
Beach - Plazha
I am positive this is French.

Risto the Great
03-10-2009, 05:41 PM
What a beautiful Macedonian dialect!

YouTube - Dialect from Suho Aegean Macedonia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uh2rhqK3aE)
I found it interesting.
Certainly not foreign ... kind of "choppy" but nevertheless sweet sounding.

Soldier of Macedon
03-10-2009, 06:18 PM
I am positive this is French.
Spanish, Portuguese and French all use a similar word to this, but Polish, Slovak, Ukranian, etc all use the same word too, they were never under French influence. You could be right, I am not sure, but how do you propose the same word was spread to all of the Slavic languages given that most if not all other marine terms are native?

For the record, I seldom use Plazha myself, I would generally say "ke oime na more" rather than "na plazha".

MapleLeaf1
03-11-2009, 03:03 PM
How about the most Macedonian word for beach, BEACHOT:D

Soldier of Macedon
08-22-2009, 02:39 PM
Chupeto kalesho go kandisal da doi oti e bendisal nogu, bara da si oi na pravio pat i poikje ne se udisa so tie sho prat pakosi.

Чупето калешо го кандисал да дои оти е бендисал ногу, бара да си ои на правио пат и поиќе не се удиса со тие шо прат пакоси.

I took most of the above words from the unique Macedonian words thread and created a sentence to reference it against Serbian and Bulgarian in google translate. Neither of them came near comprehension, any speaker of the other Slavic tongues would be lost if the above was said to them.

Risto the Great
08-22-2009, 04:32 PM
No chance to decipher that SoM.
There are over 40 distinct languages (not dialects) in Ghana. And we Macedonians have to continually put up with slurs against our identity from the wolves that are our neighbours. Tiresome.

Soldier of Macedon
08-23-2009, 03:41 AM
RtG, do you guys use the word 'otsku' for a 'little' or 'small' amount, and the word 'kotskando' in the following way: "Glei kostkando bebeto" (Look [at] the little baby)?

Risto the Great
08-23-2009, 04:59 AM
"kotsku" is definitely used the same way. I have not really heard your other variations but have never professed to be an expert on these matters.

Soldier of Macedon
08-23-2009, 09:28 PM
Can you put it in a sentence?

Risto the Great
08-23-2009, 11:37 PM
I don't know .... but tend to think of it referring to something "samo kotsku" meaning "only this small".

Soldier of Macedon
08-24-2009, 01:45 AM
Here is how I would use them:

Glei kotsku mi dava - Look how little he is giving me
Otsku mi dade - Little he gave me (Or "This much he gave me", usually said with a hand gesture accompanied that indicates a small amount)

Risto the Great
08-24-2009, 02:55 AM
ha ha .... I was going to say hand gestures were an important part of using that work!

George S.
08-25-2009, 10:34 PM
There is the usage & abusage in everyday speech people add things & meanings change over time.where one thinks its one meaning it becomes another.
George S.

King Makedon
08-29-2009, 04:43 AM
Here is how I would use them:

Glei kotsku mi dava - Look how little he is giving me
Otsku mi dade - Little he gave me (Or "This much he gave me", usually said with a hand gesture accompanied that indicates a small amount)

kotsku???

i know it as kolkicku.


it is a deminutive of kolku/ kolkav/ kolkava/ kolkavo

vidi go kolkicav e maliov.
vidi ja kolkicava e malava
kolkicku - tolkichku (kolku? - tolku!)


I also never heard of ganzaj

we use "shunjaj" instead

ne se shunjaj be
or
ne se vlechkaj be
or
sho se shunjash (vlechkash) ti be?

King Makedon
08-29-2009, 05:07 AM
A lot of slang words are taken from serbia/turkey.
like
kezenje- loughing smeenje
kenjanje- shitting serenje/kakanje
kenef - WC VC/ nuzhnik /klozet
cipeli - shoes chevli
papuchi - slipper vlechki / pandufi
tanjir - dish chinija

osiris
08-29-2009, 05:08 AM
hey risto there are a few different dialects within lerinsko and some of the dialects from lerinsko and bitolsko are in fact identical. the people in sveta petka bitusha kbasnitsa rako opsirina and a few others speak exactly the same as the villages in the republic from dragosh to bukovo excluding bukovo places like lazhets velushhina graeshnitsa kanina and so on, confirming beyond any shadow of doubt that our national identity is the same.

King Makedon
08-29-2009, 05:33 AM
There is one which i'm not sure if it is true macedonian word, because i never heard others it saying:

kenkalo person (mostly young children) who always is like " no, i don't want to do that, wheee"
nemoj da kenkash!

Soldier of Macedon
08-29-2009, 07:18 PM
A lot of slang words are taken from serbia/turkey.
like
kezenje- loughing smeenje
kenjanje- shitting serenje/kakanje
kenef - WC VC/ nuzhnik /klozet
cipeli - shoes chevli
papuchi - slipper vlechki / pandufi
tanjir - dish chinija
KM, where in Macedonia are your origins? I am from Bitolsko, never heard of kezenje, kenjanje or kenef. Regarding Kotsku, in the south there is a tendency to shorten words more than usual, something shared largely by people in Bitola and Lerin, however, the people from Skopje that I have grown up with here in Australia have also tended to do this, sho praish rather than shto pravish for example, etc, maybe that is because a lack of 'formal' education in the literary language, or because they mingle with many Bitolcani. I know papuci for moccasins and vlechki for slippers, but never heard of pandufi. We use both tengere and cinija but not for the same thing.

I agree with you that Kolku is the origin of Kotsku. It is interesting knowing that the variant of 'Kotskando' and the word 'Ganzai' are not familiar to most other members here, must be characteristics limited to only a few villages in Bitola.

Soldier of Macedon
09-24-2009, 02:12 AM
Who here has heard of the phrase "ne vrevi", and knows what it means?

George S.
09-25-2009, 05:32 AM
It's like shut up & don't talk for the walls have ears.I agree some of the sayings are peculiar to the regions.For example celi means shoes,ptceli means bees,ossi means bees,konduri means shoes.Different things in bitola & different in Ohrid.Mistri in bitola means vledtchki in Ohrid.In ohrid me kardisa means youve taken a picture.In bitola da te slikash.Some of the practices of the restaurants if they don't have toilets they give you a bottle to do it at the back in bitola.kompir in bitola (potato) krompir in ohrid.

Jankovska
09-28-2009, 05:32 AM
HEy King Makedon. We say ne kenkaj, dosta mi kenka na glava. It's like stop whining.Ja sum od Palanka. Ne vrevi will be ne digaj galama:).

Soldier of Macedon
09-28-2009, 05:39 AM
Yeah, its something a mum would say to a back-chatting child, lol.

George S.
09-28-2009, 11:26 AM
Spanish, from Vulgar Latin *plattea, from Latin platea, broad street; see place.Etymology: From Spanish meaning a "town square" or central place of gathering
.Na kapejne,na more,bechot,na plivajne.Aijde na pliskajne.I remember the people in the cities use the aijde da odime na Plazha.sounds kind of fancy.

Gj. Puleski
10-24-2009, 07:17 PM
KM, where in Macedonia are your origins? I am from Bitolsko, never heard of kezenje, kenjanje or kenef. Regarding Kotsku, in the south there is a tendency to shorten words more than usual, something shared largely by people in Bitola and Lerin, however, the people from Skopje that I have grown up with here in Australia have also tended to do this, sho praish rather than shto pravish for example, etc, maybe that is because a lack of 'formal' education in the literary language, or because they mingle with many Bitolcani. I know papuci for moccasins and vlechki for slippers, but never heard of pandufi. We use both tengere and cinija but not for the same thing.

Знам дека ќе бидеш непријатно изненаден, SoM, ама за бељата ние сме земјаци, бидејки и јас сум со битолска жица. Роден сум и живеам во Скопје, но татко ми е од Битола. Затоа ќе се обидам овде да дадам мал прилог во дискусијата за јазикот.

Зборовите што ги даде King Makedon се србизми (и турцизми) и претежно се употребуваат на север, во Скопско, Тетовско и Кумановско:

kezenje- loughing smeenje (in a stupid way)
kenjanje- shitting serenje/kakanje
kenef - WC VC/ nuzhnik /klozet
cipeli - shoes chevli
papuchi - slipper vlechki / pandufi
tanjir - dish chinija


King Makedon вели:

I also never heard of ganzaj.
we use "shunjaj" instead
ne se shunjaj be
or
ne se vlechkaj be
or
sho se shunjash (vlechkash) ti be?


Но, ова е ПОГРЕШНО:

Shunjaj не е исто што и ganzaj.
Што се шуњаш ? не значи Што се влечкаш ?

Што се шуњаш ? на српски значи Што се прикрадуваш ? (Why are you sneaking ?)


-Еве неколку зборови по старо-битолски:

-WC (нужник) се вика АЛЕ
-Подрум (cellar) се вика КЕРАЛ
-Чинија (plate) се вика ПАЈНЦА
-Влечка (slipper) се вика ПАНТОФЛА (а не : пандуфа)

Bill77
10-25-2009, 04:58 AM
What is alarming, is that our language back at home is changing. I am wandering how diferant it will be in 100 years from now (not that we will be around). Its all europes fault lol, and will get worse once we enter EU i think. some examples of what we used to call it and what is comonly called now days,

nuznik - wc(pronounced ve ce) or plain closet (english)
priatno or zbogum - cao (Italian)
odlicno - super (english)

i know my grandfather would be rolling in his grave listening to this modern euro friendly lingo. lol


By the way Soldier of Macedonia, kenef is used by all egejci. Another worf Egejci use is pinci or pinki i supose its short for opinci or kalcuni.

Soldier of Macedon
10-25-2009, 07:08 AM
I have never heard of Kenef before so I can't confirm or deny either way, are you from the south William?

Risto the Great, do you also use this word?

Gj. Puleski seems to think it is a Serbism or Turkism.

Bill77
10-25-2009, 07:39 AM
I have never heard of Kenef before so I can't confirm or deny either way, are you from the south William?

Risto the Great, do you also use this word?

Gj. Puleski seems to think it is a Serbism or Turkism. I am mixed up SOM lol. grandfather born egejsko dell. But took off to Bitola during the otoman rule. parents born Bitola. mums mum born egejsko dell aswell. so bit of everything but macedonian all the same. we call it nuznik. But married to egejka and have some relatives from down sth and all say kenef.

Soldier of Macedon
10-25-2009, 09:21 AM
Thanks mate, interesting stuff, sounds similar to the varied uses of pechurka and gaba in Macedonia.

Risto the Great
10-25-2009, 12:11 PM
kenef is used in my Mothers village as normal parlance, it is used in Dad's village but only in a filthy way .... Like going to the 'shitter' instead of nuznik - restroom.

Bij
10-25-2009, 06:42 PM
I have heard the word 'Kenef' used in bitola quite a bit, but i think it's something they've picked up recently. When I asked what this was, they told me 'kaj so odi i czarot peski'

Gj. Puleski
10-27-2009, 08:38 PM
For example celi means shoes,ptceli means bees,ossi means bees,konduri means shoes.Different things in bitola & different in Ohrid.Mistri in bitola means vledtchki in Ohrid.In ohrid me kardisa means youve taken a picture.In bitola da te slikash.Some of the practices of the restaurants if they don't have toilets they give you a bottle to do it at the back in bitola.kompir in bitola (potato) krompir in ohrid.

1-In the literary Macedonian, for shoes you say ЧЕВЛИ (chevli). In the Bitola region they use the variant ЧЕЛИ, and in Skopsko they call them КОНДУРИ, which is a turcism.

2-ПЧЕЛИ means bees, but ОСИ (ossi) does not mean bees. ОСИ means wasps.

3-"Me kardisa" is wrong. It should be "Me kadrosa" . It means : you have taken (a) picture of me. But it is an old fashioned word (end of 19th and beginning of 20th century) and now is used unly for joking. So, now they use (everywhere in Macedonia) : "Ме сликаш" (you are taking a picture of me).

4-The story with the bottle as a replacement for the toilet paper is also a misinterpretation, I think. It is often possible that you will not find toilet paper in the toilets of the restaurants in Macedonia, but when you find a botle there it is because of the habit of moslems to use water instead of toilet paper. They will preffer the bottle even if there is toilet paper.

5-The standard (literary) word for slippers is ВЛЕЧКИ, and МИСТРИ, ПАНТОФЛИ abd ПАПУЧИ are dialectic variants.

6-The standard word for potato is КОМПИР, and "кромпир" is a serbism. The serbian influence is significant in the north of the country (Skopje, Tetovo, Gostivar, Kumanovo, Kriva Palanka), so I doubt that they say KROMPIR in Ohridsko.

Soldier of Macedon
10-28-2009, 01:46 AM
How significant is it Pulja, give us some examples. Do you use them, and if so, how?

makedonin
10-28-2009, 04:24 AM
Kenef is related to Kenja.

Kenef > WC
Kenja > to do the thing in WC

Kolku sho znam, i Srbite go koristat kenja.

makedonin
10-28-2009, 04:28 AM
Does anyone know Bishka > old pig in it's form Bishok.


I know this words related with pig and pork, assigned to the animal depending on their age or function:

Svinja > swine (general)
Gude > small pig
Prase > small pig ready to be slaughtered
Matorka> Mother pig
Bishka > old pig (indifferent of gender)

George S.
10-28-2009, 06:05 AM
It's like slang if you can compare it.People don't pronounce their words & over time its coming out like someone is slurring ,can deterioate like someone is drunk.You get that from certain villages in macedonia. On a list of wordsBitolski Ohridski
Kompir-krompir,Celi-osi,mistri-vledgki.You are definitely right SOm it's a language within a language.

Bill77
10-28-2009, 06:33 AM
On the matter of macedonian language, There is a french book "Lexique macedonian from 16 century" which inside the auther found many Greek documents, writen in Greek, but the greeks could not understand the meaning of these words. The auther changed the greek letters to latin and what he discovered is pure macedonian language we speak today.

interview with macedonian president ivanov which is spoken in macedonian but subtitled in english on this matter

YouTube - Gorge Ivanov-za imeto (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CRljtUA-G4)

imam drugi informacia za "lexique" ama ne go razbervam sto saka da kazat. Ne sum siguren dali da go kazam na ova forum. Ako saka nekoj da go procita pred da se pokazi ili dali nekoj znaj od preje za ova "lexique" pozz:macedonia

sory wrong link here is the corect one
YouTube - For Greek and Bulgarian lies END! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irL0IZIQgJY&feature=related)

Bij
10-28-2009, 06:41 AM
On the matter of macedonian language, There is a french book "Lexique macedonian from 16 century" which inside the auther found many Greek documents, writen in Greek, but the greeks could not understand the meaning of these words. The auther changed the greek letters to latin and what he discovered is pure macedonian language we speak today.

interview with macedonian president ivanov which is spoken in macedonian but subtitled in english on this matter

YouTube - Gorge Ivanov-za imeto (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CRljtUA-G4)

imam drugi informacia za "lexique" ama ne go razbervam sto saka da kazat. Ne sum siguren dali da go kazam na ova forum. Ako saka nekoj da go procita pred da se pokazi ili dali nekoj znaj od preje za ova "lexique" pozz:macedonia

Bill, i dont understand why you wouldnt post any information you have?? that sounds pretty ground breaking to me!

Bill77
10-28-2009, 08:18 AM
Bill, i dont understand why you wouldnt post any information you have?? that sounds pretty ground breaking to me! The info i googled and came up with, elaborates a bit more about this scripts that are translated. It give some specific they deciphened but a lot of it is technical something linguists would understand.

Neznam od koj e pisano i rasprajeno. Neznam dali ke ne pomozi ili propaganda e protiv nas. Duri da go razberi nekoj da ne mu dajme pojke propaganda na dushmanite. Mozam da gi pushtam linkovite mjegu PM ako saka nekoj sto razbira da gi procita prven.

Bill77
10-28-2009, 08:52 AM
Here you go guys, make of it what you will. enjoy.:macedonia

http://mahimahi.uchicago.edu/media/faculty/vfriedm/031Friedman83.pdf

http://mahimahi.uchicago.edu/media/faculty/vfriedm/031Friedman83.pdf

makedonin
10-28-2009, 08:57 AM
Фридман е добар и про македонски.

Не би очекувал дкеа шири грчка пропаганда.

фала бил77

Bill77
10-28-2009, 12:05 PM
Фридман е добар и про македонски.

Не би очекувал дкеа шири грчка пропаганда.

фала бил77Fala Bate za conformacia. The more i look at it the more i understand it.

I also wish to apoligise for the wrong link of President ivanov on this subject back on post 80. i have corected it But here it is again.

YouTube - For Greek and Bulgarian lies END! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irL0IZIQgJY&feature=related)

Gj. Puleski
10-28-2009, 03:31 PM
How significant is it Pulja, give us some examples. Do you use them, and if so, how?

I have 2 posts previous to you question, and in each post I mentioned several issues. So, it is not clear to me what is your question related to.

George S.
10-28-2009, 04:03 PM
i have heard it used in bitla & surrounding cela.Kenef=toilet.nuznik=toilet,

Gj. Puleski
10-28-2009, 05:11 PM
Does somebody know what does mean "Onadi go!" (Онади го!)

Soldier of Macedon
10-28-2009, 07:14 PM
I have 2 posts previous to you question, and in each post I mentioned several issues. So, it is not clear to me what is your question related to.
How significant is the Serb influence. You are from Skopje, do you use significant Serb influence.

Let me know if it is still unclear or if you require clinical definitions of each word in my sentences.

Gj. Puleski
10-28-2009, 09:49 PM
How significant is the Serb influence. You are from Skopje, do you use significant Serb influence.

The Serb influence was greatest in the period between the end of WW1 (1918) and the German occupation in 1941. In that period Macedonia was a part of Serbia (so called Vardar Banovina) and the official language was the Serbian. But, that was a short period of about 22 years. The second phase was after the WW2 (1945) till the independence in 1991. In that period the official language was the Macedonian, but the children learned Serbian in the elementary school as one of the subjects, and most of the beletristic, the newspapers and the tv-programs were in Serbian. That period lasted 46 years. After the fall of Jugoslavia (1991) that influence is much weacker. The real threat now is the - English language. In this period of 18 years it has succeed to eliminate many macedonian words and, for instance, the younger generations already don't know that we have our (different) words for "application", "implementation", "flyer", "CV", "file" ... (they think that "application", "implementation", "flyer", "CV", "file" ... are Macedonian words).

Soldier of Macedon
10-28-2009, 09:52 PM
Thanks for the history lesson, but I am aware of all that.

You made the statement that there is "significant" Serb influence in the way people speak in northern parts of Macedonia such as Skopje. You are from Skopje.

Give me an example of this "significant" influence.

Are you understanding me clear yet, or do I need to rephrase for the 3rd time?

Bill77
10-28-2009, 10:17 PM
Don't wary about the skopje region, (who i don't think speak diferantly then say Bitolcani) But try understanding the people in kumanovo lol.

Look, some states in australia also have diferant words for diferant meanings or object. Just like bitolcani say maslo for cooking oil where skopjani use zitin. But keep in mind i was born and raised down under so i am far from an expert. But what i am getting at is Evan in australia there is some diferance, such as Melbournians call sport shoes runners, where sydney siders call them joggers. They can also be called sneakers etc. Also the pronouciation of the letter E in a word for example, A person from woolangong tried to teach me the proper way for saying "BELT". The E in belt is sounded as in the first letter in egg. where i now the E in belt sounding as in the first two letters in [out] rhyming with belt. But this is way out of my league and what i am saying could be diferant from the above discussion.

Bill77
10-28-2009, 10:25 PM
Also Syney siders can't play sport where as Melbourne dominate in it. Storm- victory-Bushrangers-aussie rules lol :45:

Sory for off subject i need to lighten up the place.

Bij
10-28-2009, 11:34 PM
Also Syney siders can't play sport where as Melbourne dominate in it. Storm- victory-Bushrangers-aussie rules lol :45:

Sory for off subject i need to lighten up the place.

lies!! someone ban this guy ASAP!!!! he is really a greek.

j/k bill, thanks for the links, i'll have a look and see if anything makes sense to be in a few.

Gj. Puleski
10-29-2009, 08:27 AM
Thanks for the history lesson, but I am aware of all that.

You made the statement that there is "significant" Serb influence in the way people speak in northern parts of Macedonia such as Skopje. You are from Skopje.

Give me an example of this "significant" influence.

Are you understanding me clear yet, or do I need to rephrase for the 3rd time?


My dear bitolski kabadaija (do you know this word?),

Arogance does not make you wiser. Why don't you try a litle politness for a change ? And what you certainly should do is to learn to express yourself clearer.

The fact that the Macedonian language (the dialect) in the north of the country has many serbisms is not only due to political changes and influences, but also because of geographic closeness. Because of that, both languages influenced eachother. In that sense, we can also say that the Serbian language (the dialect) of the south of the Serbian country has some simmilarities with the Macedonian (words etc.). This is why the serbian dialect from the south of the country (the cities Ниш and Врање) sounds strange to the rest of Serbians and they often make jokes on that account.

Here some examples for serbisms in the Macedonian from the Skopje-region:

РУКИ hands
НОГИ legs
ШАМАР slap
КОШУЉА shirt
ОДЕЛО suit
МАРАМА kerchief; shaw
MАРАМЧЕ handkerchief
МАШНА tie
ЛЕПТИР butterfly
СВАСТИКА sister-in-law
ПОКЛОН gift
ЈАБУКА aple
ШАШАВ crazy
ШАЛА joke
СИЈАЛИЦА bulb
СЕЉАК peasant
ПРЕТИЦАЊЕ passing
КРОВ roof
ПРЉАВ dirty

Gj. Puleski
10-29-2009, 05:21 PM
Three words in Skopje-dialekt, but not of Serbian origin (Serbs would not understand them):

НЕКЊА
ИСКАЧА
ОНАДИ

Bij
11-03-2009, 12:21 AM
wikipedia - ultimate lost cause.

Soldier of Macedon
11-04-2009, 04:22 AM
My dear bitolski kabadaija (do you know this word?)
No, I don't know this word. Are you talking about the word Kabetlija? Sounds like an old Turkicm to me.
Arogance does not make you wiser. Why don't you try a litle politness for a change ?
I am not being arrogant, just being realistic and practical. Don't forget your entry into this forum mutse, as you carried the banner of Shmuelism, you made your own path here, why is my acceptance that important? If you think you could have done better upon entry, then redeem yourself by your posts (which you have done to a certain extent), if not, stop citing my lack of favour or politeness. Quite simple, isn't it? Or was that still a tad arrogant?
In that sense, we can also say that the Serbian language (the dialect) of the south of the Serbian country has some simmilarities with the Macedonian (words etc.).
So, Macedonian (north) has definetly been influenced by Serbian, but Serbian (south) merely shows similarities with Macedonian? Sorry, I don't buy it, it sounds a little Serbocentric or even SDSentric. Slavic dialects have a continium which render borders artificial to a large extent, at least where it concerns the dialects that share a close affinity. A huge percentage of the similarities between Macedonian and Serbian in general existed prior to Macedonia's occupation by Serbia and later the kingdom of SCS, especially in the north of Macedonia.

Should we go back further? Or is it completely impossible that the poor Macedonians had any influence over the northern neighbours?

Bij
11-04-2009, 05:03 AM
there's a doco from bitola about the 'bitolski kabadaja', quite funny actually.

but you are right, it is a turkism

Jankovska
11-04-2009, 10:51 AM
Oi, I am from Palanka i si zborim kako mi na mene tekne i ako srbite zborat kako mene neli mislis deka moze od nas naucile. I ja pisuem so ruki i odim so nogi i ulazam unutra i iskacam nadvor i imam krov nad glava i sam prljava i cista, ponekad seljak, ponekad graganin,ponekad sam sasava, ponekad luda, ponekad lepim samari a ponekad pleskam slakanici. What is your point here? Zasto ne e mozno Srbite da naucile od Palancanite nekoj zbor ili Bugarite od Strumicanite? Zasto uvek mora da znaci deka ja sam zemala nesto od niv? Sto kurac so ovoj? Ja ne idem da krsim jazik, ja vaka zborim i ne sam srbinka. Moz oni se makedonci a? I na kraj ke ti kazam svasta zboris (puuu naduma se srpski ja)

Soldier of Macedon
11-04-2009, 09:31 PM
Hehehe, nicely said Jankovche!

Gj. Puleski
11-04-2009, 10:26 PM
No, I don't know this word. Are you talking about the word Kabetlija? Sounds like an old Turkicm to me.

I am not being arrogant, just being realistic and practical. Don't forget your entry into this forum mutse, as you carried the banner of Shmuelism, you made your own path here, why is my acceptance that important? If you think you could have done better upon entry, then redeem yourself by your posts (which you have done to a certain extent), if not, stop citing my lack of favour or politeness. Quite simple, isn't it? Or was that still a tad arrogant?

So, Macedonian (north) has definetly been influenced by Serbian, but Serbian (south) merely shows similarities with Macedonian? Sorry, I don't buy it, it sounds a little Serbocentric or even SDSentric. Slavic dialects have a continium which render borders artificial to a large extent, at least where it concerns the dialects that share a close affinity. A huge percentage of the similarities between Macedonian and Serbian in general existed prior to Macedonia's occupation by Serbia and later the kingdom of SCS, especially in the north of Macedonia.

Should we go back further? Or is it completely impossible that the poor Macedonians had any influence over the northern neighbours?



Kabaetlija (not : kabetlija) and kabadaija are both old turkisms, but are 2 different words. Kabaetlija means guilty, kabadaija means someone behaving arogant like a village-sherif.

I do not fell a need to "redeem" myself for anything, because I haven't done anything wrong. As you know, I am not the one who is calling names, cursing an spiting on the oponent in order to "prove" that my arguments are stronger. What I do is the opposite of that. I defend the basic democratic principles that "Everybodi is innocent until proven guilty", that everyone has the right to express his/her opinion (without fear that he/she will be punished with insults), and that even political opponents should treat eachother decently. Apparently, these principles are unknown to you, or at least don't mean anything to you. This is noticable not only in your behaviour in the Sam Vaknin "case", but also in the way you are treating other people here on the Forum - often making unnecessary enemies instead of friends of the Macedonian Cause. I know that this is difficult to understand for you, but you should be aware that every time when you are labeling and insulting your oponent (instead of convincing him/her with arguments) you are declaring that you are not recognising the basic democratic principle of freedom of speech. That is not a good reference for this Forum and that is why I will from time to time remind you that respecting the opponent is the psychological quantum that makes the difference between sane PATRIOTISM and paranoic NATIONALISM.

I completely agree with you that "Slavic dialects have a continuum which render borders artificial to a large extent, at least where it concerns the dialects that share a close affinity." So, I was not "selling" (and you certainly should not "buy" it) that "Macedonian (north) has definetly been influenced by Serbian, but Serbian (south) merely shows similarities with Macedonian". That was just way of speaking, but combined with your passionate need for biteing and posting negative labels it did wonders - and in a second I earned one more qualification in my CV : the one of being "Serbocentric or even SDSentric". Браво бе земјак, навистна си шампион!

Gj. Puleski
11-04-2009, 11:18 PM
oi, i am from palanka i si zborim kako mi na mene tekne i ako srbite zborat kako mene neli mislis deka moze od nas naucile. I ja pisuem so ruki i odim so nogi i ulazam unutra i iskacam nadvor i imam krov nad glava i sam prljava i cista, ponekad seljak, ponekad graganin,ponekad sam sasava, ponekad luda, ponekad lepim samari a ponekad pleskam slakanici. What is your point here? Zasto ne e mozno srbite da naucile od palancanite nekoj zbor ili bugarite od strumicanite? Zasto uvek mora da znaci deka ja sam zemala nesto od niv? Sto kurac so ovoj? Ja ne idem da krsim jazik, ja vaka zborim i ne sam srbinka. Moz oni se makedonci a? I na kraj ke ti kazam svasta zboris (puuu naduma se srpski ja)

Абе много сте на крај срце вие паланчани. А и ти па зимаш здраво за готово што ќе ти каже овој битолчанац. Мисли малко сас своју главу. Ја само кажа оно што је општо познато и што га никој не спори: дека на север од Македонија има повише србизми одколко на југ. Исто така, на југ од Србију се осеќа македонски утицај и тука нема ништо лошо. Дури може да се каже дека сите словенски јазици се дијалекти на еден заеднички јазик кои географски се прелеваат друг. Од друга страна, за време српско (1918-1941) и за време југословенско (1945-1991), заради само државно уреѓење имало знатно поголем утицај на српски језик према македонски отколко обратно. Можеш ли овој да га спориш?

Soldier of Macedon
11-05-2009, 12:07 AM
As you know, I am not the one who is calling names, cursing an spiting on the oponent in order to "prove" that my arguments are stronger.
You have me curious sherrif, show me where I spit on you and call you names.
This is noticable not only in your behaviour in the Sam Vaknin "case", but also in the way you are treating other people here on the Forum - often making unnecessary enemies instead of friends of the Macedonian Cause.
Shmuel Vaknin is a lying moron. Let me see what sort of category you think I have put you in, who are these other people on the forum that I 'treat' in such a way? Personally, I think the members of the MTO are made of stronger stuff, and if they felt they were 'treated' in any particular way I am sure they would have made their feelings known. Instead, we have you, who is doing the exact same thing that Shmuel was doing, trying to unsuccessfully taint the image of the MTO with your version of the 'truth'.
I know that this is difficult to understand for you, but you should be aware that every time when you are labeling and insulting your oponent (instead of convincing him/her with arguments) you are declaring that you are not recognising the basic democratic principle of freedom of speech.
Give me examples to back up your opinion bre Pulja, you "know" I am this, you "know" that is difficult for me, you "know", you "know", you "know" jack is all you "know". To be quite honest, I am getting really sick (and quick) of your baseless accusations and double-standards here, a word of advice, start backing up your opinions.
That was just way of speaking, but combined with your passionate need for biteing and posting negative labels it did wonders - and in a second I earned one more qualification in my CV : the one of being "Serbocentric or even SDSentric". Браво бе земјак, навистна си шампион!
Yes, well that "just a way of speaking" is the way Serb racists speak, zatoa drug pat, zemjak, da razmislis pred da pisis, klaisi go prsto na pamet i imai mukaet, when you write things about such topics it will be taken literally. This way, you can save the scrambling that you inevitably do after it has been brought to your attention.

Let me show you but one example of your "just a way of speaking" and how it is utterly false and misleading. You said that "Ruki" is a Serbism in the Skopje dialect of Macedonian, I say a load of garbage. Now, let me refer you to a quote from Krste Misirkov in his On Macedonian Matters:
The Veles-Prilep-Bitola-Ohrid dialect is truly the core of the Macedonian language because to the west one finds the Debar dialect in which, for example, the word arm (raka) is pronounced roka, while in the south (the Kostur dialect) it becomes ronka, in the east (the Salonica dialect) r’ka, and in the north (the Skopje dialect) ruka.
This was written in 1903.

Now, zemjak, you tell me, as a Skopjanec, is this a Serbism, or were you wrong?

Daskalot
11-05-2009, 04:34 PM
Owl - Buf (Latin)*

*Buljina in Croatian, Buhal in Bulgarian, Buf in Albanian, Bufnita in Romanian, Bufo in Portuguese, Buho in Spanish. It seems to be a Latin loanword, the common Slavic word for an 'owl' is Sova.

Na selski nije go vikame to vrapche "Utka"........... :sailor:

makedonin
11-06-2009, 01:52 PM
Its common negation of the Macedonian language by the Tatars, saying that the sounds: љ,њ,ѓ,ќ are comunist invention, (pulevski is counting the љ,њ as Serb characters, but clearly the sounds are existend in Macedonian language.).

Well Gjorgia Pulevski (not the MTO member) has written something different in his Obshta Makedono-Slavjanska Istorija.

Pay attention to the red underlined lines (I put the rest pages about the alphabet characters for completeness sake too):

http://i34.tinypic.com/23mpw5x.jpg

http://i34.tinypic.com/espw9f.jpg

http://i35.tinypic.com/o8xhye.jpg

As you see the sound values of:

ль>љ,

нь>њ,

гь>ѓ,

кь>ќ corespond to each other.

The given examples are words that still exist today, and are sounded exactly as today.

Interestingly, this sound јь is not familiar to me.

There are much more from Pulevski

makedonin
11-06-2009, 02:12 PM
By the way, the Tatars were trying to sell Puleski as Serboman, saying that in the Three Languages book, where he writes S. Macedonian, the S. as if it stands for Serbo-Macedonian.

The above excerpts proves the oposite. Pulevski clearly speaks about the Macedonian language, and compares sounds and characters with the Serbian language, and their use.

Mygdon
12-18-2011, 01:37 PM
anyone know bakovdzija?